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Author Topic: Do Owners Really Care?  (Read 2386 times)
Respect
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« on: November 21, 2005, 07:28:08 AM »

Just wondering what everyones oppinion is on these owners with the trainers getting positive tests.

Do they(owners) really care about their horses or is it just greed?  How can you send your horses to someone that isn't being a honest trainer and then to think your horses health could be in jeapordy with the drugs these trainers are using? 

With All Do "RESPECT"
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trotter
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« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2005, 07:32:33 AM »

Look on the board. Positives for baking soda and banamine. Hardly any hard core drugs there.  I don't think you'll have to worry about any health hazards with those two.
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edwardwilliam
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« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2005, 08:11:50 AM »

Look on the board. Positives for baking soda and banamine. Hardly any hard core drugs there.  I don't think you'll have to worry about any health hazards with those two.

Okay -- I'm going to take a wild stance here...

I've not really heard anything that said that either soda or banamine could really be harmful to a horse...so why not legalize them??

Best,
EW
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redneck
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« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2005, 09:30:50 AM »

Just wondering what everyones oppinion is on these owners with the trainers getting positive tests.

Do they(owners) really care about their horses or is it just greed?  How can you send your horses to someone that isn't being a honest trainer and then to think your horses health could be in jeopardy with the drugs these trainers are using? 

With All Do "RESPECT"

Yes , I care, especially after you claim one doing good and then he goes downhill and you have to sell him to the Amish (two trainers later) just to get out from underneath him!!

I really don`t think you need an answer to your question, it depends on who the person is.
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njhorseman
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« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2005, 09:48:42 AM »

Okay -- I'm going to take a wild stance here...

I've not really heard anything that said that either soda or banamine could really be harmful to a horse...so why not legalize them??

Best,
EW

EW:
It's not a wild stance. Here's what should be legal, in my opinion, when administered by the vet in a controlled amount, and reported to the public on the racing program:
(1) Baking soda or similar alkalizing agent
(2) Lasix
(3) Up to two NSAIDs, such as bute and banamine.

Once this medication program is implemented, any violation of the rules with respect to these medications, such as excessive levels of bute, lasix, or TCO2 in the blood, should carry more severe penalties than they do today. Also, the allowable TCO2 levels for horses not treated under this program has to be dropped from the current 37 (non lasix) and 39 (lasix). Studies have proven that horses who have not been treated with baking soda simply don't have TCO2 levels that high.
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shuffledagain
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« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2005, 11:35:43 AM »

Yes.  I care.  I will not play the game in some jurisdictions.  Had 13 head in MI once.  Pulled horses from one trainer as soon as it was apparent he was using.  Would never put capital in that states program again.  It's (IMO) not an even playing field.
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dt2
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« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2005, 12:51:04 PM »

Imo

Most owners only care about a couple of things.

1. getting there picture taken
2.covering there training bill's
3.recouping there initial investment
4.making money.

As far as, do they care about illegal drugs being used on there horses to gain the upperhand, perhap's the ihha president would like to field that question.
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njhorseman
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« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2005, 02:03:11 PM »

Yes.  I care.  I will not play the game in some jurisdictions.  Had 13 head in MI once.  Pulled horses from one trainer as soon as it was apparent he was using.  Would never put capital in that states program again.  It's (IMO) not an even playing field.

I can't argue with you about NJ not having a level playing field, BUT, what state does? Outside of testing for EPO, which, last I checked, in the US is only done in NY, DE and IN, what is there about NJ that makes it any less "level" than any other state?  The only thing I can think of is that the large purses at the Meadowlands attract more vermin than the chump change doled out elsewhere, but that is not something the state is responsible for or can control.
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2005, 04:08:25 PM »

Okay -- I'm going to take a wild stance here...

I've not really heard anything that said that either soda or banamine could really be harmful to a horse...so why not legalize them??

Best,
EW

Edward
              There was a time that we could give 10cc's of Banamine on race day with no problem. Then that all changed.
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trotter
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« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2005, 04:10:17 PM »

Jersey,

   For ONCE I totally agree with you.   There was a huge deal made when KY changed their rules.  They used to allow banamine and something else, maybe robaxin, allowed race day.  Big deal made out of this when they changed the rules to not allow it. Their going to clean up racing in KY. Very funny.  If they think that has any affect on anything they are dumber than I think they are.
 Big whoop!!  Anyone who thinks you can make a cripple sound by using banamine must use more than I ever did.  It doesn't mask anything, it just helps.  Horses with broken bones are still going to be lame, it isn't that big a deal.  
       God bless baking soda...poor mans answer to tying up. Helps bleeders, and used correctly it doesn't hurt a horse.

    No they don't want us to use that, it only cost 59 cents a box.  Let's use robaxin, ATCH, anything that cost over 50 bucks for the vet to give.
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Respect
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« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2005, 04:49:48 PM »

Look on the board. Positives for baking soda and banamine. Hardly any hard core drugs there.  I don't think you'll have to worry about any health hazards with those two.

Trotter,

Are you telling us that if Baking Soda gets into a horses lungs that it can't kill a horse?  Someone in this state of IL.  had this happen not to long ago.  Do I have to mention any names? 

With All Do "RESPECT"
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TC
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« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2005, 05:11:13 PM »

Trotter,

Are you telling us that if Baking Soda gets into a horses lungs that it can't kill a horse?  Someone in this state of IL.  had this happen not to long ago.  Do I have to mention any names? 

With All Do "RESPECT"
Respect, are you out of your cotton pickin', blumen- mind ?  You can't mention names behind such offenses - LOL  TC  P.S. ...such a mentioning would be like robbing Peter to pay PAUL, for Christ's sake !  Wink
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BIG FAN
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« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2005, 05:15:17 PM »

I really care about my race horses!I am a hands on small stable owner.I am always real careful who I claim off of or who I would by a horse off of.I think I have had pretty good luck over the years Smiley
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trotter
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« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2005, 05:16:00 PM »

Actually it isn't exactly the baking soda in the lungs..its any liquid in the lungs.  Another point to make it legal, actually have a vet do it.  Theres a new concept. I had one die from worming, maybe we shouldn't do that anymore either.
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sn
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« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2005, 05:53:30 PM »

Fan, you've seen horses that have left our barn and went to another trainer, Tell everyone what condition they were in!!! tell these guys if they ever looked like they have been abused or given the Kitchen sink every week!!! Be honest please!!
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BIG FAN
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« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2005, 05:55:41 PM »

 8)
« Last Edit: November 21, 2005, 08:51:48 PM by BIG FAN » Report to moderator   Logged
Respect
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« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2005, 09:31:28 PM »

Respect, are you out of your cotton pickin', blumen- mind ?  You can't mention names behind such offenses - LOL  TC  P.S. ...such a mentioning would be like robbing Peter to pay PAUL, for Christ's sake !  Wink

No TC, I'm not out of my cottin pickin; blumen-mind.  I'm in it for the opinions on what others may think of sending their horses to trainers that are known for getting positive tests.  I don't care what the heck they are using - a positive is a positive.  I'm sure everyone knows who these guys are.  No need to mention any names.  Self respect for these individuals.

Anyways, why don't you go and bum some $$$ off daddy and buy a real good bred baby and send it to a trainer well known for this and then talk to me about this topic when your horse gets the positive thru these cheating bottle trainers.  Well in this case a box trainer.  I wonder if they buy Arm & Hammer or the generic stuff.  Knowing these cheaters they buy the generic and charge the owners for the name brand.   Wink
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TC
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« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2005, 11:23:02 PM »

Respect, you can but the industrial sized sodium bicarb bottles at many places. Don't do it though, it is a cheap way to win and cut corners.  St. PAUL once wrote "...for the rose to blum, men, it must be attended to in the feld, day and night..."  Sorry if the quote isn't exact, my Jerome Bible is on loan.  TC
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