Chicago Barn to Wire
Home | News | Bloggers | Forums | Resources | Links | Marketplace | Gallery | Contact Us | Search


November 26, 2014, 11:31:27 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you don't remember your password, email me.

New  registration procedures -- Some ISPs have been bouncing the verification emails.  Please email me to be activated or if you have any problems.  Click Contact Us above.
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Do We Need More Harness Tracks ??  (Read 733 times)
Homestretch
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 7731

Harness Racing is "King" Of All Sports




Ignore
« on: March 15, 2013, 02:30:40 PM »

THE NEW MONTICELLO RACEWAY IS ABOUT TO BEGIN CONSTRUCTION, AND THIS ONE IN PA. SEEMS TO BE A POSSIBILTY !!
DO WE NEED MORE RACETRACKS TO FURTHER DILUTE THE INDUSTRY ??

Extension granted for PA's Valley View track

March 15, 2013

Valley View Downs, the track proposed for northwestern Pennsylvania, is still alive. The developers of the track have received an extension until May 31 to put together their financing to build the racino.

Valley View Downs was once a project in the Centaur portfolio but is now the property of a Philadelphia-based investment group known as Endeka Entertainment. Endeka is trying to raise $170 million in financing.

Also, according to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, Endeka is in talks with Penn National to perate, and perhaps purchase, the racino in exchange for financing. Penn National is presently in the process of constructing new facilities for Raceway Park and Beulah Park in Ohio. Beulah Park is being relocated to the Youngstown area, which would put it about 20 miles from New Castle, Pa., where the Valley View racino would be located.
Report to moderator   Logged
sam
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 11949

have fun win money




Ignore
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2013, 02:40:29 PM »

as a big betor   the more the merier if they make money why not    let's not get negative here  if you love the sport the more exposure the beter plus more tracks keeps are sport alive
Report to moderator   Logged

may the horse be with you
APPRENTICE
Guest

« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2013, 02:43:29 PM »

YEAH WE NEED 3 MORE BETWEEN,,PENNYSLVANIA ,,AND NEW JERSEY..

WHAT ARE U A  WISE GUY laughing guy laughing guy laughing guy laughing guy laughing guy head shake head shake head shake
Report to moderator   Logged
sam
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 11949

have fun win money




Ignore
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2013, 02:46:26 PM »

there goes luc again insults



OH BEHAVE
Report to moderator   Logged

may the horse be with you
Dolfan
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 6558




Ignore
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2013, 02:47:18 PM »

The simple answer is obviously no.  On the contrary we probably need fewer for the sake of the health of the sport.

When thinking long term survivor-ship, we have to find a way to be self-sustaining.  The choice for the individual track is either to find that way or be one of the (many) victims who fall by the wayside.
Report to moderator   Logged

We can produce more wealth, but we cannot produce more time.  When we give someone our time, we actually give a portion of our life that we will never get back.
harrylare
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 419




Ignore
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2013, 03:10:14 PM »

as a big betor   the more the merier if they make money why not    let's not get negative here  if you love the sport the more exposure the beter plus more tracks keeps are sport alive
Report to moderator   Logged
checkbook
Newbie
*
Posts: 17




Ignore
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2013, 03:13:23 PM »

There aren't enough horses to fill the box at tracks now.With breeding down in the last three or four years and tracks wanting nine, ten or even more horses in a race additional tracks just doesn't make any sense. Penn National is the largest gaming company in the nation but to build two racinos twenty miles apart would seem ludicrous and I do not believe that Penn would invest in a negative.  
Report to moderator   Logged
stone162
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1115




Ignore
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2013, 03:15:35 PM »

There aren't enough horses to fill the box at tracks now.With breeding down in the last three or four years and tracks wanting nine, ten or even more horses in a race additional tracks just doesn't make any sense. Penn National is the largest gaming company in the nation but to build two racinos twenty miles apart would seem ludicrous and I do not believe that Penn would invest in a negative. 

Great post!
Report to moderator   Logged
Homestretch
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 7731

Harness Racing is "King" Of All Sports




Ignore
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2013, 04:06:12 PM »

The simple answer is obviously no.  On the contrary we probably need fewer for the sake of the health of the sport.

When thinking long term survivor-ship, we have to find a way to be self-sustaining.  The choice for the individual track is either to find that way or be one of the (many) victims who fall by the wayside.
thumbs up thumbs up
Report to moderator   Logged
pacinfool
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 509




Ignore
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2013, 04:09:37 PM »

Easy answer. Tell me how many harness racetracks did they have 30 years ago that are closed now? How many were opened in that same period? As a horsemen and not an owner or bettor not everyone has stock that fits Yonkers, Big M, Pocono, etc,etc. The states that lost racing had a lot of tracks close. Where do these horsemen go? They are slowly running out of venues where their stock can compete. I understand the variables so don't bore me with your exacting knowledge of lotteries, casinos, and all the other venues that take gambling dollars from harness racing. T-breds have the same problems but, they are more organized, more well run, well liked, better following, etc. The problem is there are a number of states that could have harness racing if they tried but, who will step up when harness racing lacks financial backing to have someone run a meet. Just for example there was and maybe still is a track that was in perfectly good condition outside of Phoenix in Goodyear, Arizona. They ran a harness meet there in 1965 for one season and half a season the next. They closed and never raced another race there. A brand new half mile track, grandstand and the works sat there for 40 years.....why? The main reason why they closed it was way out of the way and was hard to get to because there was no development there at the time. It was long before the advent of computer and satellite wagering. Still why didn't anyone take a chance on a meet there. They could have got plenty of horses to race from the western half of the country including the midwest as well. No one will step up because harness racing has a bad reputation and is totally mismanaged and doesn't know how to take care of the problems that give harness racing a black eye. The fairs are the grass roots where this sport evolved from and someday it will end up going full circle. Not many tracks can stand on their own through their own handle so it is only a matter of time before slot revenue will diminish all together. Then these tracks will eventually close as well. So, the answer is yes but, it won't happen.
Report to moderator   Logged
sam
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 11949

have fun win money




Ignore
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2013, 04:28:27 PM »

EVERYBODY WANTS THEM TO CLOSE    when they are gone then what
Report to moderator   Logged

may the horse be with you
pacinfool
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 509




Ignore
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2013, 06:41:12 PM »

EVERYBODY WANTS THEM TO CLOSE    when they are gone then what

 Then they are gone for good. The breeding industry has been diving since 1980. No breeding, no racing.....it isn't rocket science. No real incentives to breed. Most breeders lose money every year.....hence why it has been diving for over 30 years.

 Anyone who talks about wanting to see nothing but, top of the line horses doesn't understand the whole business. I love to see good horses race too but, they all can't be good. What happens to a horse when they can't compete at the same level anymore.....where do they go even if they still can race but, just not at the same level. Should they all be slaughtered just because they can't go in 51, 52, 53 , or slower and of course every track has different speed ratings. MR isn't the same as PCD. One person I knew that bred a ton of horses was asked about some of his good horses he bred and his quote was ..... they are all 2 or 3 claimers. It is just a matter of time when they become that caliber of horses. Most sooner, some later.

 In the old days a bunch of owners were just happy to be part of the business. They weren't interested in their horse making a lot of money.....it was the fun of winning a race and having their friends with them and getting there picture taken and making a good memory. Once people didn't have to go to the track and could stay at home to watch racing and also watch their horse race.... the overall mentality changed as well. So many tracks don't have but, a handful of people at the track compared to back in the day. It's sad and that is the trend.
Report to moderator   Logged
checkbook
Newbie
*
Posts: 17




Ignore
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2013, 09:13:50 PM »

Pacinfool, Phoenix was a great track when James Dunnigan built it. Great grandstand, well laid out barn area, nice training track across the road, and a very fast 5/8 mile track, just built in the wrong place. I believe if this track had been built north of Los Angles it would still be operating. Goodyear Arizona was a small town with very little population and was 25 miles  west of Phoenix with a two lane road. When it rained the patrons were stranded in the grandstand because the roads would flood. This track had no chance of serving from day one. Maybe with enough money, the right people and the right place, maybe Memphis, a small track could be a diamond in the rough.
Report to moderator   Logged
Juicejunkies
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 18071

Ignore Button Below↓↓↓


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2013, 12:20:49 AM »

If they aren't gonna close then a reduction in dates and work together to maximize the sport.

Closing a few is a quick answer and several racinos would love to just be CASINOS.

Report to moderator   Logged
pacinfool
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 509




Ignore
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2013, 06:45:45 AM »

Pacinfool, Phoenix was a great track when James Dunnigan built it. Great grandstand, well laid out barn area, nice training track across the road, and a very fast 5/8 mile track, just built in the wrong place. I believe if this track had been built north of Los Angles it would still be operating. Goodyear Arizona was a small town with very little population and was 25 miles  west of Phoenix with a two lane road. When it rained the patrons were stranded in the grandstand because the roads would flood. This track had no chance of serving from day one. Maybe with enough money, the right people and the right place, maybe Memphis, a small track could be a diamond in the rough.

 Yes... you are so right. What a waste at the time but, now is a different story. Too bad the USTA doesn't try to promote getting new operators to open existing facilities. The place would be the perfect spot to have fall, winter, and early spring racing. The horsemen would love it and it would bring business to the area. They could have like a 7 month meet with real nice weather. I always wondered why the powers that be in Cali never tried. I think the place had some potential if the right operators came in. Nowadays everybody wants the tracks to be a racino. If you can't get approved for slots they won't touch it.
Report to moderator   Logged
JLB
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 280




Ignore
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2013, 07:04:00 AM »

Pacinfool, you are absolutely right about the old days, when we did it for the fun (jogging horses in the morning, having a trip to the winners' circle at night), and not really caring if it cost something in the long run. I have been a fan since I was 10, and owned horses-mostly MR, Pocono, occasionally Meadowlands-since 1988. The recession caused me to take a break, and I do not know if it is permanent. What scares me about re-entering, besides having to compete against the "super-trainers", are the costs involved, especially now that most tracks do not offer on-track stabling. The thought of spending several hundred dollars to ship, and paddock, to draw an outside post on a half-mile track, or face horses I simply cannot beat, on a larger track, makes me wonder how I can come close to breaking even, much less turn a profit. And you are right, there could be untapped markets, but no one has the courage, or the bankroll, it seems, to find out.
Report to moderator   Logged
Homeboyhanover
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 1868




Ignore
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2013, 08:59:59 AM »

Until you can convince horsemen they need to send a greater amount of the slot money to the breeding programs and less to the rent a horse overnights, you will need less tracks with less dates.
Report to moderator   Logged
Steve G
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 808




Ignore
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2013, 04:07:26 PM »

absolutely not
Report to moderator   Logged
Juicejunkies
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 18071

Ignore Button Below↓↓↓


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2013, 04:11:17 PM »

absolutely not

Can you elaborate?
Report to moderator   Logged
Steve G
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 808




Ignore
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2013, 04:27:48 PM »

Can you elaborate?



simple question was asked, and a simple answer was given.
Report to moderator   Logged
Juicejunkies
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 18071

Ignore Button Below↓↓↓


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2013, 04:39:25 PM »



simple question was asked, and a simple answer was given.

I FORGOT HOW SIMPLE YOU WERE.
Report to moderator   Logged
Steve G
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 808




Ignore
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2013, 04:58:38 PM »

I FORGOT HOW SIMPLE YOU WERE.


simple is the way i live my life!!  you ought to try having a life yourself, but i suppose living on here and pretending to be somebody is your life.
Report to moderator   Logged
cecil127
the cat batting the VIP mouse!
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 3608




Ignore
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2013, 05:11:00 PM »


simple is the way i live my life!!  you ought to try having a life yourself, but i suppose living on here and pretending to be somebody is your life.

u got that right.  posting picks of his computer in his shack/trailer (that are so prevalant in upstate ny) would get old really quick so he just makes chit up and keeps the fantasy going...i bet he cries, often laughing guy

Report to moderator   Logged

hard work never killed anyone, but why risk it....
Herve Filion
Juicejunkies
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 18071

Ignore Button Below↓↓↓


WWW

Ignore
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2013, 05:16:21 PM »

u got that right.  posting picks of his computer in his shack/trailer (that are so prevalant in upstate ny) would get old really quick so he just makes chit up and keeps the fantasy going...i bet he cries, often laughing guy



i like kleenex.
Report to moderator   Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.121 seconds with 16 queries.

Home
Upcoming events
Breeders' Cup
Horse slaughter in IL
Racing TV schedule
News Updates
Legislation

Galloping Out

Previous stories

Arlington
Balmoral
Hawthorne
Maywood
Chicago Sun-Times
Chicago Tribune
Blood-Horse
Daily Racing Form
Thoroughbred Times
Harness Link
Illinois Racing Board

 

2014

Breeders' Cup
Arlington Million
Triple Crown
Illinois Derby

2013

Breeders' Cup
Hawthorne Gold Cup
Arlington Million
Triple Crown
Illinois Derby

2012

Breeders' Cup
Hawthorne Gold Cup
Arlington Million
Triple Crown
Illinois Derby

More ebay items

 

Home | News Updates | Bloggers | Forums | Search
Resources | Links | Marketplace | Gallery | Advertising | Contact Us

Copyright © 2000-2014 Chicago Barn to Wire. All rights reserved.
Privacy policy