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Author Topic: O.T. RIGHT TO WORK!  (Read 1562 times)
Yimmy
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« Reply #100 on: December 13, 2012, 02:46:49 PM »

Did you go to public school?
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Pal B
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« Reply #101 on: December 13, 2012, 03:24:25 PM »

Or the fact you have a gutless Republican legislation who's main purpose of RTW is to stop the flow of money from Unions who support Democrats. See it's not the will of the people, that Republicans support it's the will of he who has the most money should rule. Now today Republicans in Michigan are hiding behind the fact they pander to the pro life constituents for votes to pass abortion laws all behind the lie that there trying to make them safer for women. I'd have much more repect if they came out and just said what there up too, instead of hiding behind a wall of lies.

Once again, aren't you the party of choice and isn't right to work simply a choice? If a union is doing their job and charging a fair due, won't most people stay for the other protections a union provides besides wage negotiations? The union I belonged to was about 70/30 Democrat to Republican in our plant, 110 employees, yet all of the contributions went to Democrats. Is that fair?
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Yimmy
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« Reply #102 on: December 13, 2012, 05:35:13 PM »

Did you go to public school?

Hello?  Trim Tab?
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #103 on: December 13, 2012, 06:16:19 PM »

Did you go to public school?

catholic grade school
public high school
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Yimmy
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« Reply #104 on: December 13, 2012, 06:17:39 PM »

I was asking him, since he was defending the public school teachers.
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #105 on: December 13, 2012, 06:22:16 PM »

I was asking him, since he was defending the public school teachers.

i must disagree with an earlier comment where you denigrated " most teachers "
without any data to back that comment up it does not ring tru for me
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Yimmy
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« Reply #106 on: December 13, 2012, 06:28:36 PM »

Tross, I don't know how old you are, but I suspect that age-wise, you're roughly a contemporary of mine, and that, like me, you went to school a million years ago, when dinosaurs roamed the earth.  (I note you also went to a Catholic school; that's ALSO a different story). 

Things have changed.  I have kids in the schools.  Different world now.

 
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #107 on: December 13, 2012, 08:08:50 PM »

will be 57  in jan
yes the world has changed and in many cases not for the better.i think that is what the older folks were saying when we were kids.i pity those who have kids in school nowadays
going to a catholic grammar school did make a difference with the smaller class sizes and the strictness
going to a public school which was overcrowded and racially divided was eye opening. 30-35+ kids in a class and people who could not do long division as freshmen

in either case i always saw plenty of good and bad teachers
i still cannot say there is more bad than good teachers as you do
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Yimmy
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« Reply #108 on: December 13, 2012, 08:22:39 PM »

Well, I'll repost what I said.  Perhaps it'll make things clearer:

"Though it was not ever thus, public school teachers nowadays, with some shining exceptions, are the also-rans of intellectual competition (Paul Fussell's formulation, btw).  Concerned parents do the teaching themselves.  If the parents are illiterate, the kids are going to be illiterate.  The stuff about "illiterate immigrants" is somewhat off-mark... do you really think those engineers and gastroenterologists from the Punjab are illiterate?  The illiteracy is RIGHT HERE; just read this board if you doubt me, or, if you really want a double dose of it, read the P*-L-O-PPPPP."

I have emphasized the salient phrase there.

As you may (or may not) know, I'm an advocate of Catholic education; the best school I ever went to was a Catholic school. I'm sure I've posted that here before.



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Illinois sucks
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« Reply #109 on: December 13, 2012, 08:51:29 PM »

I maybe younger than most of you guys but what may have changed most these days both parents work or off the top of my head 50% are divorced.  Seems like watching shows or movies from the 50' and 60's the wife stayed home while the husband worked.  Also less avenues for kids after school back in the day.  Middle class America even through the 80's and mid 90's seem to be the case.  Mom was always around to help with school work.   My wife like I mention is a school counselor at a public high school ____ East, the horror stories I have heard over the past 12 years, with single Mom's working two or three jobs, or the teenager taking a job to help, kids helping with the younger kids as parents worked, pregnant teenagers, truancy, kids who don't care just in general, just to name a few.  We have a seven and nine year old our time is spent with math, reading, and getting sight words down.  I know tougher days are ahead.  The other thing with public school and there teachers are most educated in one subject but just to have a job are teaching a whole different subject.  These days with the rising cost of living both parents work having less time to have there house in order.  We are our own CEO's of our little companies.  We have to lump in a lot with kid weekly activities, school work, dinner, play time, while getting them to bed at a decent hour.  I straddle the fence on this thinking there are plenty of good teachers while many parents try there hardest to give their kids the best opportunity to succeed.
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Yimmy
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« Reply #110 on: December 13, 2012, 08:56:55 PM »

Did you go to public school or private school?
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Illinois sucks
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« Reply #111 on: December 13, 2012, 09:05:00 PM »

Small town public school. 
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Yimmy
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« Reply #112 on: December 13, 2012, 09:06:38 PM »

I don't mean to be unkind, but you know where I'm going with that, don't you?
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #113 on: December 13, 2012, 09:14:18 PM »

I maybe younger than most of you guys but what may have changed most these days both parents work

There's the issue. The cruel lords of Finance on Wall Street and the corporate hucksters of Madison Avenue have managed to create a debt culture in which Mr. & Mrs. America now BOTH have to work just to pay for the house & etc., whereas back in Ward Cleaver's day just dad with a job was enough. As a results the kids suffer in all facets of their upbringing.

Just like in all things that are wrong with America today, the wagging finger of blame comes back to the greedy Wall Street capitalists and New Yorkers in general.
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« Reply #114 on: December 13, 2012, 09:16:12 PM »

Maybe but if I had average grades in a public school you think I would have had better grades in a private school.  
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #115 on: December 13, 2012, 09:18:15 PM »

I don't mean to be unkind, but you know where I'm going with that, don't you?

You're going to ask him to critique the thread title of the Chrysler workers bashing thread?
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"There are no $7500 maiden claimers, state-bred or otherwise, at Arlington."
honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #116 on: December 13, 2012, 09:23:06 PM »

Maybe but if I had average grades in a public school you think I would have had better grades in a private school.  

Most of the literature comes to the conclusion that private schools perform about the same overall as public schools, the exception being Catholic schools which do better. So the real issue of these discussions is hating unions, not the welfare of the kids.
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"There are no $7500 maiden claimers, state-bred or otherwise, at Arlington."
Yimmy
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« Reply #117 on: December 13, 2012, 09:33:57 PM »

You're going to ask him to critique the thread title of the Chrysler workers bashing thread?

Yes, Terry.... you got the idea.

For the record, both my parents worked; both were teachers, and my mom was a shop steward for years.  My dad is actually buried literally just yards from Albert Shanker, whom both my parents idolized, up to a point.  My dad was a labor historian. My second job out of law school was for a firm which represented unions; I had a nice time there, as those things go.  I have spoken on this board of the greatness of John Altgeld, who stood up to Grover Cleveland (second term) when Cleveland outrageously called in federal troops to break the Pullman strike.  I have no inbred hatred of unions.  But I do hate what some of them have become, and, in the case of teachers' unions, how terribly anti-meritocratic most of them are.  My kids have to deal with that on a daily basis, and it's been an ordeal.

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Louie Weedelbaum
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« Reply #118 on: December 14, 2012, 11:42:10 AM »

Yes, Terry.... you got the idea.

For the record, both my parents worked; both were teachers, and my mom was a shop steward for years.  My dad is actually buried literally just yards from Albert Shanker, whom both my parents idolized, up to a point.  My dad was a labor historian. My second job out of law school was for a firm which represented unions; I had a nice time there, as those things go.  I have spoken on this board of the greatness of John Altgeld, who stood up to Grover Cleveland (second term) when Cleveland outrageously called in federal troops to break the Pullman strike.  I have no inbred hatred of unions.  But I do hate what some of them have become, and, in the case of teachers' unions, how terribly anti-meritocratic most of them are.  My kids have to deal with that on a daily basis, and it's been an ordeal.



Independent thought with a an excellent point of view, that won't go over big with HBT.  I respect you greatly for having been on both sides of an issue then using what you know to be the truth and coupling that with common sense to form an opinion on this subject.  Bravo to you sir!!
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Yimmy
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« Reply #119 on: December 14, 2012, 02:11:09 PM »

TYVM, Louie. 

If everyone agreed on everything, it would be a lesser forum. It's fun to fisk the inevitable leftist orthodoxies.
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Louie Weedelbaum
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« Reply #120 on: December 14, 2012, 02:34:50 PM »

TYVM, Louie. 

If everyone agreed on everything, it would be a lesser forum. It's fun to fisk the inevitable leftist orthodoxies.

I didn't see your thoughts as either left or right, just as common sense which many people no longer use.
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #121 on: December 14, 2012, 03:01:09 PM »

TYVM, Louie. 

If everyone agreed on everything, it would be a lesser forum. It's fun to fisk the inevitable leftist orthodoxies.

Indubitably, my good man, and also fun to fisk the inevitable righty dogma.
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"There are no $7500 maiden claimers, state-bred or otherwise, at Arlington."
Yimmy
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« Reply #122 on: December 14, 2012, 03:11:06 PM »

Hey! Your karma ran over my dogma!

Or, dogma's a ***, unless you can find owners for the litter.

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