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Author Topic: O.T. RIGHT TO WORK!  (Read 1588 times)
TheRedMile
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« Reply #50 on: December 12, 2012, 08:57:15 PM »

If I owned a business where the workers threatened to unionize, I'd close up shop and go to the Bahamas until the workers decided they wanted to work.

if you had the money why not go to the bahamas to begin ?
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« Reply #51 on: December 12, 2012, 08:59:17 PM »

If I owned a business where the workers threatened to unionize, I'd close up shop and go to the Bahamas until the workers decided they wanted to work.

You'd have to own a business before you really worry about it.
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« Reply #52 on: December 12, 2012, 09:30:21 PM »

You'd have to own a business before you really worry about it.

That's the point.  I wouldn't worry about it.  Either continue making money or retire.

Then the union thugs could beat up each other.
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« Reply #53 on: December 12, 2012, 09:37:56 PM »

Where does the US rank in education , I believe we are number one, since the strongest union in the land is the teachers union and we know it's all about the chilren with the teachers union
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« Reply #54 on: December 12, 2012, 09:44:22 PM »

We are not even close to being number one.  And you're right about the unions causing us to be "average."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/27/best-education-in-the-wor_n_2199795.html

If it wasn't for the unions protecting the jobs of incompetent teachers, we would be number one.  Do you know how hard it is to fire an incompetent teacher because of the unions?  Don't you think it would be best for the children if we kept the best teachers and got rid of the worst?
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #55 on: December 12, 2012, 09:59:09 PM »

alright here we go again let's blame the union

never mind that the politicians that run the school boards do not spend monies to provide needed supplies for the children
never mind the  bureaucracy at cps as an example

yes let's blame the unions never blame mgmt why blame the mgmt ?
they only set the failed policies and hired those bad teachers in the 1 st place
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« Reply #56 on: December 12, 2012, 11:32:49 PM »

If it wasn't for the unions protecting the jobs of incompetent teachers, we would be number one. 

We might be number one if education funding was truly important to anyone, instead of relying on gambling to educate our children ... and then of course if American parents were anywhere close to the kind of motivators Asian parents are.
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Illinois sucks
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« Reply #57 on: December 13, 2012, 01:58:02 AM »

Really Terry we rely on gambling to provide funding for education.  In 2009 29 billion was paid into the education system.  Just 7% came from the lottery system that was 692 million dollars.  15.3 bln came from local propriety taxes, 9.5 bln from state funds, and 3.5 from federal funds.  You can blame your state politicians once again for over spending in other areas on their budget shifting less money to education.  The state lottery, just 30% of the dollar goes to education.  There are 3904 public schools and secondary schools in Illinois saying the lottery was supposed to take care of education.  Kinda just like Obama thinking taxing the rich will bring down the deficit over time.  Ya right they will just spend on other areas.  However I agree with a tax increase but maybe start with incomes starting at 400k.  You can tax the rich 100% and that will let you run the federal government for a whole 74 days. 
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« Reply #58 on: December 13, 2012, 09:06:09 AM »

Really Terry we rely on gambling to provide funding for education.

It is the only form of funding that's ever promoted to INCREASE education funding. How often do you hear anyone running around saying, "We need to increase property taxes and the income tax to better fund education!" Besides Pat Quinn, that is.

Quote
You can blame your state politicians once again for over spending in other areas on their budget shifting less money to education.  The state lottery, just 30% of the dollar goes to education.

They spend money on what people want and elect them to spend it on.

Quote
However I agree with a tax increase but maybe start with incomes starting at 400k.

Why, what's the magic number there? And what does that have to to with education? The issue here is unions, and the simpleton claim that it's unions that cause our school system to be less than #1.
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« Reply #59 on: December 13, 2012, 09:31:51 AM »

Now back to unions..Is Rahm then a union or attempted union buster ?
Jaintors at O'Hare..
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« Reply #60 on: December 13, 2012, 09:41:37 AM »

Now back to unions..Is Rahm then a union or attempted union buster ?
Jaintors at O'Hare..

He's merely trying to make our airport custodial service #1 in the world by getting rid of the bad janitors. It has nothing to do with penny pinching on behalf of taxpayers who don't want to pay taxes.

What he really needs to do is something about the unions that make it impossible to do business at McCormick place. They're a good example of union rules gone too far.
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Illinois sucks
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« Reply #61 on: December 13, 2012, 09:46:25 AM »

Sure maybe the thought process was gambling profits would go to help fund education but don't you think that was a tactic to pass any type of gaming bill.  Now or 38 years ago.  Point is we don't rely on gambling to fund education.  Again just 7 percent goes to education and it is the tax payers that fund education.  Like to see the study on parents from the U.S. and Asia on how they motivate their kids can you past that on please.  Like to see what we may be doing wrong.  
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« Reply #62 on: December 13, 2012, 09:58:39 AM »

Sure maybe the thought process was gambling profits would go to help fund education but don't you think that was a tactic to pass any type of gaming bill.  Now or 38 years ago.

Not the lottery I don't think. Some of thee others, yes, it's entirely a lie.

Quote
Like to see the study on parents from the U.S. and Asia on how they motivate their kids can you past that on please.  Like to see what we may be doing wrong.

If you look at the "school and homework first" approach that Michelle Obama is taking with her kids, that's more like an Asian parent's approach than an American one. They are far more involved than the typical U.S. parent, and don't simply dump everything off on the teachers. What's more, Asian schools still believe in winners. No "trophy for everyone no matter how mediocre" mentality for them.

Here's one story. Gotta run; busy day.

http://culturequest.us/culturequestsummer/prole.html
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #63 on: December 13, 2012, 10:00:32 AM »

Sure maybe the thought process was gambling profits would go to help fund education but don't you think that was a tactic to pass any type of gaming bill.  Now or 38 years ago.  Point is we don't rely on gambling to fund education.  Again just 7 percent goes to education and it is the tax payers that fund education.  Like to see the study on parents from the U.S. and Asia on how they motivate their kids can you past that on please.  Like to see what we may be doing wrong.  

i think what we maybe doing wrong starts at home and is a result of our society
way too many kids eat most of their meals at school
we also flooded our schools with illegal immigrants who do not take the time to teach their kids or learn english themselves especially the children born here
many are born here yet by the time they go to school they still cannot speak english
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« Reply #64 on: December 13, 2012, 10:05:49 AM »

He's merely trying to make our airport custodial service #1 in the world by getting rid of the bad janitors. It has nothing to do with penny pinching on behalf of taxpayers who don't want to pay taxes.

What he really needs to do is something about the unions that make it impossible to do business at McCormick place. They're a good example of union rules gone too far.
   Bad janitors Huh? are the reason he is doing this ?
What about bad cops, firemen, ironworkers, teachers, etc ?
Why is one union wacked and privatized while the others are not ?  Unskilled vs skilled ? Or is Local 1, the union reping the janitors not tight with Rahm...Read somewhere that they were not financially or thru other means supportive of him during his mayoral(not maymoral) run.  Is this then payback rather than effieciency ?
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #65 on: December 13, 2012, 10:24:47 AM »

i do believe hbt was being sarcastic with the lousy bad janitors comment

as for your earlier question about rahm being a union buster
imo i think he is i also think like many pols he is in it for himself
i think rahm is getting kickback from;
the new bill board deal
the janitor deal
and the new charter schools that are built

yet he does nothing about chicago having more alderman than any other city
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« Reply #66 on: December 13, 2012, 10:42:40 AM »

i do believe hbt was being sarcastic with the lousy bad janitors comment

as for your earlier question about rahm being a union buster
imo i think he is i also think like many pols he is in it for himself
i think rahm is getting kickback from;
the new bill board deal
the janitor deal
and the new charter schools that are built

yet he does nothing about chicago having more alderman than any other city
Whatever happened to the consolidation/reduction the amount of alderman...Was talked about now..out of side and out of mind Huh
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« Reply #67 on: December 13, 2012, 10:54:27 AM »

First off, the three highest-income counties in the US are in a right-to-work state.  Spare me the leftie fatuities.

Throwing more money into the schools blindly is a waste (ever hear of Washington DC?).  I have kids in the schools; I know where that money goes.  By and large, it does not go into the classroom; it just goes into a vast and burgeoning administrative apparatus that does nothing. Read Brimelow's The Worm In The Apple and get back to me with your thoughts.  I've lived this.

Though it was not ever thus, public school teachers nowadays, with some shining exceptions, are the also-rans of intellectual competition (Paul Fussell's formulation, btw).  Concerned parents do the teaching themselves.  If the parents are illiterate, the kids are going to be illiterate.  The stuff about "illiterate immigrants" is somewhat off-mark... do you really think those engineers and gastroenterologists from the Punjab are illiterate?  The illiteracy is RIGHT HERE; just read this board if you doubt me, or, if you really want a double dose of it, read the P*-L-O-PPPPP.

  
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 11:09:38 AM by Yimmy » Report to moderator   Logged
honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #68 on: December 13, 2012, 12:56:27 PM »

   Bad janitors Huh? are the reason he is doing this ?

Sure. That's the reason we want to get rid of teachers unions, isn't it? He's got to start somewhere.  thumbs up
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #69 on: December 13, 2012, 01:02:52 PM »

Though it was not ever thus, public school teachers nowadays, with some shining exceptions, are the also-rans of intellectual competition

What do you expect when, with some shining exceptions like NY and IL, teacher pay, especially starting pay, is so lousy? You want keep your property taxes down and pay some young person out of school $23k to teach your kid English (as well as babysit them and parent them and buy some of their supplies out of their own salary and work a 60+ hour week), you're not really expecting to be getting the best and brightest of the American college system are you?
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« Reply #70 on: December 13, 2012, 01:10:01 PM »

What do you expect when, with some shining exceptions like NY and IL, teacher pay, especially starting pay, is so lousy? You want keep your property taxes down and pay some young person out of school $23k to teach your kid English (as well as babysit them and parent them and buy some of their supplies out of their own salary and work a 60+ hour week), you're not really expecting to be getting the best and brightest of the American college system are you?
Please note.. Starting teachers salaries in and about the chicagoland area $35k plus
Not sure where you are getting your numpers...
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Yimmy
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« Reply #71 on: December 13, 2012, 01:24:16 PM »

We overpay our teachers and get mostly GARBAGE.

My wife and I basically teach our kids.  I get English and history; she has a Masters in biology, so she takes science and math.  Most of the teachers, again with a few shining exceptions, simply do not know the subject matter, much less understand it. 

My high school in Yonkers was just as bad if not worse.  A few good ones, but mostly seriously ignorant people who could not have made it in the private sector if their lives depended on it.

The teachers at my elementary school in the Bronx were often surpassingly great.  But the school got too dangerous, and everyone ran for the 'burbs.   
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #72 on: December 13, 2012, 01:26:40 PM »

Please note.. Starting teachers salaries in and about the chicagoland area $35k plus
Not sure where you are getting your numpers...


I specifically noted that places like Illinois (at least upstate) and NY were exceptions.

Starting teachers in other less populated or rural states and poorer areas are not quite so lucky. And despite the surveys about "average starting salaries", there are plenty, especially starting at public schools, who don't get that average.

And getting back to the original complaint that US schools aren't number one, it's the results of ALL schools averaged that determines the ranking. Ones where teachers start at decent pay, and ones that can only afford to pay crap.
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« Reply #73 on: December 13, 2012, 01:27:22 PM »

We overpay our teachers and get mostly GARBAGE.

It's the same with lawyers, so go figure.
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« Reply #74 on: December 13, 2012, 01:27:39 PM »

First off, the three highest-income counties in the US are in a right-to-work state.  Spare me the leftie fatuities.

Throwing more money into the schools blindly is a waste (ever hear of Washington DC?).  I have kids in the schools; I know where that money goes.  By and large, it does not go into the classroom; it just goes into a vast and burgeoning administrative apparatus that does nothing. Read Brimelow's The Worm In The Apple and get back to me with your thoughts.  I've lived this.

Though it was not ever thus, public school teachers nowadays, with some shining exceptions, are the also-rans of intellectual competition (Paul Fussell's formulation, btw).  Concerned parents do the teaching themselves.  If the parents are illiterate, the kids are going to be illiterate.  The stuff about "illiterate immigrants" is somewhat off-mark... do you really think those engineers and gastroenterologists from the Punjab are illiterate?  The illiteracy is RIGHT HERE; just read this board if you doubt me, or, if you really want a double dose of it, read the P*-L-O-PPPPP.

  

Yeah and of the top 100 poorest counties in the US what percentage are in Right To Work States. Over 90%
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