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Author Topic: Why aren't workouts timed electronically like NFL combine?  (Read 640 times)
ThePaceMaker
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« on: December 02, 2012, 10:29:15 PM »

Wouldn't cost anything, would get more precise #s.. ?
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faster horses
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« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2012, 10:38:19 PM »

Not very practical.  Unlike a race, you have dozens of horses passing each pole every couple of minutes w/ workers breaking off at different poles at different times.  During a given work, you'd have a whole bunch of other horses passing all the poles, including the wire, while the work is in progress.  How would you do get an automated clocking on that?

Also, what would be the point?  Since workers are going at every possible effort level, from a notch above a 2-minute-lick to a strong handy work, you'd get a precise time for an unknown and undocumented level of effort, which would be worth next to nothing from a handicapping perspective.  Work times are close to useless unless you have good information about how the work was done.  (In Europe, hardly anybody ever even bothers to time works.)
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Secretariat
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« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2012, 11:17:09 PM »

and why would that be important ?

works do not translate into stakes dollars saturday afternoons,
there is some correlation in good works and running well,

but i doubt 10ths of a second is all that important 6 days away from a race, especially if you plan on routing with your son of dynaformer at 10f at that time. it might be of more importance, a FAST work for a 6f sprinter at SA a week out, but its just of little importance to measure this that accurately.

why isn't the 3 second rule counted with a clock in the NBA ?
its not all that relevant.
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Yimmy
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« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2012, 06:41:39 PM »

In NY and several other jurisdictions, they're timed in hundredths of seconds and listed as such on the worktabs.  By and large, the information is not terribly helpful; much MORE useful would be info identifying couplets.  The major Cali tracks provide trainer info, but the best of all in this regard was Keeneland, which gave couplet info in detail.  I wrote to NYRA months back to ask that SOME info be provided in this regard.  No response.   
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clockerbob
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« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2012, 10:21:50 PM »

In Japan they inbed a chip  into every horse.
Then they time using that chip.


As a clocker, when a horse starts a workout with a display of blinding speed and finishes strong along the wood while completing a sub 59-second clocking for 5/8th for Laz Barrera, thatís a good bet. You could make money betting on horses that caught your eye traveling smartly over the preferred workout distance of these trainers: Gosden (7/8th on the turf), Whittingham (a flat mile) and Barrera (5/8th).

http://www.clockerbob.com/chapter3.html
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Yimmy
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« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2012, 01:16:30 PM »

Laz Barrera died 21 years ago.   How 'bout some insider-type stuff on when to bet Eddie Neloy firsters?  head shake
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clockerbob
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« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2012, 05:08:34 PM »

Laz Barrera died 21 years ago.   How 'bout some insider-type stuff on when to bet Eddie Neloy firsters?  head shake
I'm exploring this time period........Affirmed-Waya-Spectacular Bid etc
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Yimmy
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« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2012, 05:36:07 PM »

I still have my old trainer records from that period, but with one or two exceptions, they're of little relevance these days, since most of the gods of that day are dead or retired, and the game has changed drastically.  Workouts have gotten slower and less frequent these days.  David Jacobson is tearing up the Aqeduct meet, but just looking up his winners' latest works is mind-boggling... 3/39.1... 4/52.2... 3/38.4... 3/37.4... 3/41.4 (!)... he's just one of many like that.
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2012, 05:45:39 PM »

Quote from: Yimmy link=topic=53491.msg605495#msg605495 date=135
4817790
Laz Barrera died 21 years ago.   How 'bout some insider-type stuff on when to bet Eddie Neloy firsters?  head shake

has it been that long ?

i was always a big fan of his whittingham's and stephens
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TheRedMile
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« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2012, 05:47:21 PM »

the only place workuts are a really big deal to me are at churchill in the weeks leading up to the derby
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Yimmy
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« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2012, 05:50:08 PM »

His greatest pre-Affirmed win was with sprintball Bold Forbes in the ('76?) Belmont... he brought him up to the race with long and uncharacteristically slow breezes.  Laz was good with workouts faster than 12-per-eighth, but Frank Martin (more recently deceased) was far better... half-mile in 47.2 or under, he'd win, period.  

And then, of course, there was Oscar, with whom workouts were of no relevance whatsoever. Luis fell in the middle there. Anyone know what became of Albert or Larry?
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Yimmy
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« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2012, 06:35:21 PM »

the only place workuts are a really big deal to me are at churchill in the weeks leading up to the derby

'tross, just today in Noo Yawk, Dom Schettino (who's done great work with firsters) had a first-timer, Cielo Soleggiato, who looked good on paper, with a 47bg back at the beginning of the Spa meet (among many other seemingly nice works.  But I did it little poking around, and it seemed to me that the horse had lost at least three times in company.  Happily, this saved me money.  But this scenario is replayed 5-6 times a day in good maiden races at various tracks. The times of the works are of secondary importance, IMO; how and with whom the times were accomplished is of much greater relevance.

Shit, back in the day, NYRA used to have occasional public workouts between weekend races, I remember seeing a few good Johnny Campo 3yo's go at it tooth and nail, with interesting results.  The comparative result has always been more important than the actual workout time, especially given that a lot of trainers will tell the exercise rider to go a slow 3 and then finish fast. 
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clockerbob
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« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2012, 07:23:24 PM »

Anyone know what became of Albert or Larry?
I saw larry in san diego and albert is living in Minnie
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Yimmy
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« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2012, 08:07:03 PM »

Luis had a nice-looking daughter who worked for NYRA way back in the day.  Oscar's son never won much, but now, amazingly, there is an OSB III.
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