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Author Topic: Catch driver/trivia  (Read 1838 times)
looking in
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« on: October 07, 2012, 10:14:30 PM »

Thinking of Tetrick replacing Morrill on Archangle.

Has any catch driver ever said to the owner/trainer
"no thanks put up so and so to drive"
or said
" No thanks leave up the man that has been driving"?

I have read off one such case.
Anyone know of others?
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I am just an old "Hoss" trainer, that has been raced hard and put away wet. 
As my Friend from Maine(Ora Stratton) says "There are horse trainers, and then there are real "Hoss" trainers.
looking in
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« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2012, 10:29:00 PM »

Should some one like Tetrick or Dave Magee in his prime ever say no to taking the drive away from a fellow driver or good friend that has been doing good driving the horse even though the owner/trainer doesn't think so?
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I am just an old "Hoss" trainer, that has been raced hard and put away wet. 
As my Friend from Maine(Ora Stratton) says "There are horse trainers, and then there are real "Hoss" trainers.
Goodfella
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« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2012, 11:27:33 PM »

Campbell had a prior engagement or took another horse when Jennas Beach Boy was racing. Bill Fahy got the catch drive and Hollaway stayed with him. I hate left handed drivers and drivers that rock in the bike but the driver change on Archangel was uncalled for and they got what they deserved.
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wilderness
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« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2012, 11:56:31 PM »

looking,
          You mean you've forgotten the Stanley Dancer comment to Billy Haughton regarding Peter Haughton?
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looking in
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« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2012, 06:37:57 AM »

looking,
          You mean you've forgotten the Stanley Dancer comment to Billy Haughton regarding Peter Haughton?
No !  That is the comment I was referring to.
But I thought it was Delvin Miller not Stanley.
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I am just an old "Hoss" trainer, that has been raced hard and put away wet. 
As my Friend from Maine(Ora Stratton) says "There are horse trainers, and then there are real "Hoss" trainers.
Claiming King
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« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2012, 06:57:40 AM »

The catch-driver era really began in the mid-80s and was spurred on by syndicates making big investments in horseflesh coupled with large Meadowlands purses that allowed one to make a better living by simply driving at night rather than training a large barn of horses.

Prior to that time there was much less discussion about one driver being better than another and it was simply assumed that a trainer or one of his employees/close associates/family members would drive the horses from his barn.

I remember the hue and cry when Lou Guida forced Billy Haughton off Nihilator in favor of Bill O'Donnell. You would have thought Guida had pissed in Billy's face in front of a packed grandstand to hear some people tell it. In reality it was just a guy with a lot of dough invested making what he thought was the best decision for his horse.

The attitude that an owner should just fork over his cash and keep his mouth shut still hangs on stubbornly in some quarters to this very day.
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dennycrane
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« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2012, 08:59:10 AM »

i am not a big fan of catch drivers and now you guys are feeling sorry for morrill..but when he shows up at another track and gets all the mounts on s s nite thats ok  he picks them up ..he is the man..well the guys that paid the bill figured that t t was the man..maybe jimmy should tell the connections of archangel  that if you get another one dont call me...NOT..if they have another good one and ask him to drive you can bet ur ass he will be there..its a whores game rum by whores!!!!
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wilderness
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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2012, 09:13:15 AM »

No !  That is the comment I was referring to.
But I thought it was Delvin Miller not Stanley.

 Believe your correct and ever-increasing task played a trick on my memory again.

 Hell! I'm stuck on 1945 and just recently archived a WW II confirmation of the legal death of the 3rd Miller brother, Orrin.

from Aug 15, 1945 Harness Horse:

Sgt. Orrin G. Miller Legally Declared Dead
It is with deep regret that we learn the War Department has advised Mrs. Amy Z. Miller, Bancroft Farm, Avella, Pa., that her son, Sergeant Orrin Guy Miller is legally dead, inasmuch as one year and one day has elapsed since any word has reached the Department relative to him. On July 27, 1944, Sgt. Miller, armorer-ball turret gunner and the recipient of the Air Medal, was a member of the 455th Bomb Group which had received two Presidential Citations, left the base in southern Italy in the Daughty Dragon. on a mission to bomb the Manfred Weiss steel works at Budapest, Hungary, and encountered more than 100 enemy planes. The bomber which had been on 50 missions, nine with Sgt. Miller as gunner, was one of the number which failed to return. The Daughty Dragon was seen to go down, afire, and it was afterward learned that five of the ten were captured, and hopes were entertained that possibly the other five were still alive and had escaped, but no word was ever received since the date mentioned, and following the usual procedure, Sgt. Miller was a, pronounced legally dead. He was a brother to the well-known trainer, Delvin Miller, stationed in India in our last report from him, and while likewise a great fancier of the harness horse sport did not take any active part in it. He is survived by his mother. Mrs. Amy Z. Miller, two brothers, Delvin and Albert, and a sister, Mrs. A. M. Townsend, Sandusky, O., and to them we desire to extend heartfelt sympathies from the many readers of THE HARNESS HORSE and its staff in their great loss, and we hope and believe that their grief will be assuaged to a considerable degree by his meeting a hero's death, sacrificing his young life for the general welfare of mankind.
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Regards Don
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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2012, 10:02:46 AM »

THEY ARE FREE AGENTS,,,,,PICK OFF AND ON,,,,,SO THE OWNER CAN DO THE SAME
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wilderness
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« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2012, 10:13:17 AM »

THEY ARE FREE AGENTS,,,,,PICK OFF AND ON,,,,,SO THE OWNER CAN DO THE SAME

 "What's good for the goose, is good for the gander"

"If smoking is banned on the factory floor then it should also be banned in the boardroom—what’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. The proverb was first recorded in 1670 in John Ray’s English Proverbs."

 Were there catch drivers in 1670 Wink
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Regards Don
zoot
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« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2012, 10:59:16 AM »

looking,
          You mean you've forgotten the Stanley Dancer comment to Billy Haughton regarding Peter Haughton?

what comment was made? never heard about this one
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wilderness
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« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2012, 11:17:55 AM »

what comment was made? never heard about this one

 At Roosevelt or Yonkers and for a big stake, Billy, Peter and Delvin were standing around.
 Billy asked Delvin to drive a horse, Delvin replied, "Your boy is standing right over there and has his colors on!"

 Peter drove the horse and won. Don't recall the horses name or the stake, however the reference is in the Billy Haughton and Del Miller books, and other places.
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Regards Don
zoot
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« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2012, 11:24:35 AM »

i would never have expected a classy comment like that to have come from stanley. in his mind it was all about him.

thanks, del miller was a class act
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dennycrane
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« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2012, 04:20:47 PM »

believe me.. far to much is made about catchdrivwers....i am pretty confident that morrill could of won with archangel...so  could pierce..miller..sears..get the point!!good horses make good drivers problem is that evevrybody has to use one of these guys and the others dont get a chance...i remember pat crowe and richie silverman .hell even mal bourroughs  winning major stakes...were they the best driver or did they have the best horse??
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Goodfella
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« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2012, 04:39:15 PM »

Let us not forget Clint on one of the best of all time. Wink
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dennycrane
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« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2012, 04:40:26 PM »

there you go!!!
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zoot
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« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2012, 04:55:48 PM »

few outside the game realize how much politics plays into a winning drivers sucess.

ritchie silverman won 5 $100,000 stakes the first year he drove.

thanks dad trotter
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wilderness
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« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2012, 05:42:03 PM »

Let us not forget Clint on one of the best of all time. Wink

Clint Hodgins may have been the best of all-time Wink
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Regards Don
dennycrane
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« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2012, 08:52:34 AM »

just remember this.....a bad driver on a good horse will beat a good driver on a bad horse 9 out of 10 times
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Louie Weedelbaum
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« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2012, 12:10:25 PM »

just remember this.....a bad driver on a good horse will beat a good driver on a bad horse 9 out of 10 times

Clint Galbraith driving Niatross comes to mind as soon as I read your post.
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PickfourNYC
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« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2012, 01:04:27 PM »

Clint Galbraith driving Niatross comes to mind as soon as I read your post.

Probably a lot of situations one can cite during the trainer/driver era.  Two that immediately come to my mind are

Silk Stockings - Prestin Burris Jr.
Cam Fella - Pat Crowe
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Louie Weedelbaum
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« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2012, 01:54:39 PM »

Probably a lot of situations one can cite during the trainer/driver era.  Two that immediately come to my mind are

Silk Stockings - Prestin Burris Jr.
Cam Fella - Pat Crowe


Good ones.  I never saw Burris win unless it was Silk Stockings.
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zoot
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« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2012, 02:03:46 PM »

what about the rich amateur guy that drove the winner of the hambletonian and the other billionare from pennsylvania that made all his $$$;s in coal mining ??
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clubhouse
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« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2012, 02:13:34 PM »

Good ones.  I never saw Burris win unless it was Silk Stockings.
Those are 2 of the best horses ever.
Has Pat Crow won a race since Cam Fella ?
9 out of 10 is way too high of a percentage.
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Louie Weedelbaum
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« Reply #24 on: October 09, 2012, 02:16:34 PM »

what about the rich amateur guy that drove the winner of the hambletonian and the other billionare from pennsylvania that made all his $$$;s in coal mining ??

Mal Burroughs.  Owns thoroughbreds now.
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