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Author Topic: AP vs. Hawthorne at IRB meeting today  (Read 2836 times)
APCD Dan
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« on: September 24, 2012, 11:29:06 PM »

Janine has posted Neil Milbert's article in the Tribune on this showdown.  It will be interesting if the IRB can do anything for Hawthorne.  I would take the Derby away from AP, plus some dark dates, with the idea that Mr. D uses his influence with CDI to encourage them into including the Illinois Derby as a valid prep for the Kentucky Derby.  If it works, he can have his dates back.  This action probably would not be legal, but it is an idea.

I hope somebody from BTW with a smart phone can attend this meeting to update us as things happen.  Some of these meetings have been interesting to watch.  There are interesting people there too, as I sat with Terry and Jim O'Donnell one year.

The tracks used to have to make presentations to win support for their dates.  They went in alphabetical order and finished up.  There was one problem, somehow, they forgot Fairmount.  The guy who responded for Fairmount had a priceless response to that slip up.
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2012, 11:49:27 AM »

I see that AP is once again trying to take away Hawthorne dates in order to pay for three evenings of racing during the summer.

"Arlington also is seeking to hold evening racing on three selected dates in June and July with the first race starting at 5 p.m. 'and/or 6 p.m. if the requested dark time is awarded to support night racing.' This dark time would come at the expense of Hawthorne."

Another great example of dedicated "capitalists" like Frank Stronach trying to build something to benefit themselves with someone else's capital, only this time it is Mr. D doing it. If ya want gosh dang night racing, just open your wallet and do it!
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jrstark
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« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2012, 12:33:28 PM »

Marcus is tweeting:
https://twitter.com/DRFHersh

Flannery of CDI on Illinois Derby: "It simply didn't measure up."
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nmslim
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« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2012, 01:09:53 PM »

No one trotted out the War Emblem example as a reason to make it a centerpiece? Shocking!
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HorseVoice*
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« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2012, 01:30:44 PM »

Flannery of CDI on Illinois Derby: "It simply didn't measure up."

What, and the Sham and the Sam F. Davis did?

Another barefaced lie from the guy at CDI.
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2012, 01:33:50 PM »

What, and the Sham and the Sam F. Davis did?

Another barefaced lie from the guy at CDI.


I liked the tweet about Flannery spewing how a track also needs to televise well ... like Sunland Park, and Turfway, and Aqueduct, is probably what he meant.
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« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2012, 02:00:25 PM »

Marcus just tweeted that AP introduced a financial consultant to comment on Hawthorne's finances.

(Yes, you read that right.)

According to Marcus, the consultant is saying Hawthorne is busted.

If RLD's nerve were a string, it would reach from here to planet Neptune. What a slimy mother censor he is! I might break my boycott of AP just for the chance to spit right in his face, the prick.
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HorseVoice*
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« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2012, 02:39:31 PM »

Come on, IRB -- have some balls, and stick it to AP and their old dustfarter boss for once on the g.d. dates!

Give the Ky Derby back to Hawthorne, and chop up the Jan - Feb dark time money...since Haw is so bustedRoll Eyes

One Time!
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2012, 02:43:58 PM »

Since the IRB pretty much has a history of doing nothing, I predict next year's dates will look eerily similar to this year's, no matter how much white noise, bluster, lies, and hot air poor Marcus has to sit through today. Might be one of those days when they don't reach their lofty decision until after a nice dinner on the taxpayers' dime.
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HorseVoice*
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« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2012, 02:50:33 PM »

Since the IRB pretty much has a history of doing nothing, I predict next year's dates will look eerily similar to this year's, no matter how much white noise, bluster, lies, and hot air poor Marcus has to sit through today. Might be one of those days when they don't reach their lofty decision until after a nice dinner on the taxpayers' dime.

This is indeed the most likely outcome, but...the dates *have* changed over time, in a manner favorable to AP.

Just hoping for a turn in the opposite direction, even if it's a small one, just to get a message to RLD and CDI:

"NO, you CAN'T have everything your damn way!"
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« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2012, 03:47:59 PM »

My hope is that the decisions made are what is best for the long term viability of Illinois racing. Making decisions to spite or send a message doesn't help fix our mess.  If Hawthorne is the best place for attendance and onsite handle for the Derby, then let them have it.  If AP can make better use of the date, give it to them. 
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g3tPWNed_24
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« Reply #11 on: September 25, 2012, 03:53:32 PM »

lol it would never happen but have both tracks run derby day. make it a alternating card(believe the ohio tracks used to do this somedays) between the two tracks with hawthorne having dirt races only and AP having turf races only
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nmslim
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« Reply #12 on: September 25, 2012, 03:55:33 PM »

Come on, IRB -- have some balls, and stick it to AP and their old dustfarter boss for once on the g.d. dates!

Give the Ky Derby back to Hawthorne, and chop up the Jan - Feb dark time money...since Haw is so bustedRoll Eyes

One Time!
[/quoteGosh,why aren't you there dazzling everyone with your knowledge of everything equine related?I am surprised they did not call you to thrall them with your acumen.
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« Reply #13 on: September 25, 2012, 04:00:10 PM »

Gosh,why aren't you there dazzling everyone with your knowledge of everything equine related?I am surprised they did not call you to thrall them with your acumen.


To "thrall" them?

My, you are a caution.

 head shake
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« Reply #14 on: September 25, 2012, 04:02:55 PM »

My hope is that the decisions made are what is best for the long term viability of Illinois racing. Making decisions to spite or send a message doesn't help fix our mess.  If Hawthorne is the best place for attendance and onsite handle for the Derby, then let them have it.  If AP can make better use of the date, give it to them. 

Well, you clearly don't look at things like RLD and CDI, who just want it all for them (whether it helps Illinois racing or not), and right now.
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beobob
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« Reply #15 on: September 25, 2012, 04:05:33 PM »


To "thrall" them?


 head shake

I remember in my old Junior High (that's right, "Junior High", it was before there was "Middle School") Print Shop class, we had "em" and "en" spaces.

I believe an "en" is appropriate here.
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HorseVoice*
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« Reply #16 on: September 25, 2012, 04:07:13 PM »

lol it would never happen but have both tracks run derby day. make it a alternating card(believe the ohio tracks used to do this somedays) between the two tracks with hawthorne having dirt races only and AP having turf races only

Honestly, this is one of the best ideas I've ever heard.

Hawthorne's last live day, AP's first -- and as John wrote, dirt races at Haw and turf races at AP.

Brilliant!  trophy

(Which means, unfortunately, that it could never happen. RLD isn't going to do what makes sense if he isn't winning something. This would be a compromise.)
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beobob
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« Reply #17 on: September 25, 2012, 04:10:14 PM »

lol it would never happen but have both tracks run derby day. make it a alternating card(believe the ohio tracks used to do this somedays) between the two tracks with hawthorne having dirt races only and AP having turf races only


Make it so, Number One.
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HorseVoice*
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« Reply #18 on: September 25, 2012, 04:11:21 PM »

I remember in my old Junior High (that's right, "Junior High", it was before there was "Middle School") Print Shop class, we had "em" and "en" spaces.

I believe an "en" is appropriate here.

Yes, Bob. You know that, and so do I...but it's news to our Assistant Stall Mucker for Broken Down Horses in Three Jurisdictions.  Wink
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g3tPWNed_24
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« Reply #19 on: September 25, 2012, 04:25:39 PM »

thanks lol. both tracks get a crowd but not overcrowded like it tends to be on derby day and have live racing and make money and everyone is happy(well supposed to be)


Honestly, this is one of the best ideas I've ever heard.

Hawthorne's last live day, AP's first -- and as John wrote, dirt races at Haw and turf races at AP.

Brilliant!  trophy

(Which means, unfortunately, that it could never happen. RLD isn't going to do what makes sense if he isn't winning something. This would be a compromise.)
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2012, 04:30:19 PM »

lol it would never happen but have both tracks run derby day. make it a alternating card(believe the ohio tracks used to do this somedays) between the two tracks with hawthorne having dirt races only and AP having turf races only

Would just make more sense to do away with the stupid host track rule that makes some other out-of-state track's race the most important winner-take-all day in Illinois racing. Whoever is actually running on Derby Day keeps the simulcast money they can generate at their track and outlets, and the other tracks and OTB's keep the money they earn without having to hand most of it over to the host.
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« Reply #21 on: September 25, 2012, 04:39:32 PM »

Would just make more sense to do away with the stupid host track rule that makes some other out-of-state track's race the most important winner-take-all day in Illinois racing. Whoever is actually running on Derby Day keeps the simulcast money they can generate at their track and outlets, and the other tracks and OTB's keep the money they earn without having to hand most of it over to the host.

So, the more desirable you make your betting location(s), and the more attendees and $$$ you bring in...the more you get to keep for yourself?

Sounds like capitalism to me...as in, how other business sectors in the free world work.

How would that ever work in horse racing?  dunno
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beobob
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« Reply #22 on: September 25, 2012, 04:53:38 PM »

Yes, Bob. You know that, and so do I...but it's news to our Assistant Stall Mucker for Broken Down Horses in Three Jurisdictions.  Wink

Just to clarify, I knew you were poking the initial author.  I was just piling on.  Wink
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« Reply #23 on: September 25, 2012, 05:01:08 PM »

Just to clarify, I knew you were poking the initial author.  I was just piling on.  Wink

Oh, I got that, absolutely.

And thanks for the assist: the guy comes out here spewing venom, pisses in *my* Post Toasties, then claims I'm the bad guy. What a f'n nutjob!  screwy
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honest & balanced terry
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« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2012, 05:16:16 PM »

So, the more desirable you make your betting location(s), and the more attendees and $$$ you bring in...the more you get to keep for yourself?

Sounds like capitalism to me...as in, how other business sectors in the free world work.

How would that ever work in horse racing?  dunno

Of course they would also need to revise the rule on number of OTBs per track ... either make them unlimited and let people compete with however many they thought were correct, or do away with the Dick Special rule that allows him to have twice as many OTBs as anyone else thanks to his closed track out in the Quad Cities. Anyone else doesn't race live for that long their OTB licenses are gone, but not tricky Dick.
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