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Author Topic: BTW Looks Pathetic!  (Read 4180 times)
Dan Nance
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« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2006, 11:38:03 AM »

More great stuff on the number one forum in harness racing!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Go to the Rumor thread and respond about the Warren rumor and the Ledford rumor.

    NOW WE'RE TALKING HARNESS RACING

P.S.
      Don't forget to tell your friend Joe B. to be at Hawthorne when SN wins his first race. And tell him he'll be a good witness in court when I sue Doc for saying what he said to him.
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Petro
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« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2006, 11:38:28 AM »

I am sure Doc will give SN John Drew!!!!
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2006, 11:41:15 AM »

I am sure Doc will give SN John Drew!!!!

I think they don't like eachother because Doc is friends with Joey Papa and Papa and Scott hate eachother.
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swoodall
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« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2006, 01:34:18 PM »

tonym'sperforatedcolon

Those old posts you refer to are from Joe Dakuras about my dad on the old forum.  He made one post in a 11 paged thread that lasted about 4 hours on the thread to be publicly viewed on a weekday morning.  He had a phone conversation with Janine shortly after making the post and the post was then removed and Joe apologized for using my dad as his source because Joe never talked to him about me and Joe admitted he made it up.  Joe did the honorable thing and apologized and I did the honorable thing by fully accepting his sincerity and apology.  We have since become allies and I have publicly admitted I was wrong about Joe's motives.  How can I be sure of the content and the events following that post?  I still have that whole thread in it's original entirety on hard copy.  All I had to do for this reply was reread that old thread.  That ignoramus is the evidence and you haven't DISPROVEN anything.  Perry Mason's job is still safe.

So let me clear up a misconception once and for all with the BTW members who do know me but not all my personal history.

I do NOT now or have ever received government disability.  Not government insurance or assistance in anyway.  Unless you are a moron and consider a handicap parking placard government assistance.  All my financial and insurance means are privately obtained and never included Social Security.  When I have been asked by trainers we used in the past about my finances I told them I was receiving disability.  I never said Social Security or what type of income I was receiving,  any assumptions they made about the source was their conclusion and not facilitated by me.  How much I have or how I get it is none of their business.  But I did make the mistake of telling Tom a little too much of my personal life.  So any comments like the one you made are either made out of personal ignorance and bias or made because I mislead you into believing that scenario through our phone conversations.

I should probably change my 100% certain to 99% certain you are Tom Wendt because you did hang with Edward quite a bit.  It's plausible you relayed our conversations to Edward and he drew the same conclusions.  So there is a .99% chance you are Edward.  The other .01% chance would have to be directed towards Eric Ledford or Erv Miller and the chance one of them would waste their time on BTW is less than the chance of repealing recapture.  One last scenario possible is when the old forum crashed or was hacked,  you were able to read my pm's from Joe, TC, and others that I never deleted.  But that scenario brings us back full circle and right back to you TOM.

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tonymfan
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« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2006, 01:53:07 PM »

tonym'sperforatedcolon

Those old posts you refer to are from Joe Dakuras about my dad on the old forum.  He made one post in a 11 paged thread that lasted about 4 hours on the thread to be publicly viewed on a weekday morning.  He had a phone conversation with Janine shortly after making the post and the post was then removed and Joe apologized for using my dad as his source because Joe never talked to him about me and Joe admitted he made it up.  Joe did the honorable thing and apologized and I did the honorable thing by fully accepting his sincerity and apology.  We have since become allies and I have publicly admitted I was wrong about Joe's motives.  How can I be sure of the content and the events following that post?  I still have that whole thread in it's original entirety on hard copy.  All I had to do for this reply was reread that old thread.  That ignoramus is the evidence and you haven't DISPROVEN anything.  Perry Mason's job is still safe.

So let me clear up a misconception once and for all with the BTW members who do know me but not all my personal history.

I do NOT now or have ever received government disability.  Not government insurance or assistance in anyway.  Unless you are a moron and consider a handicap parking placard government assistance.  All my financial and insurance means are privately obtained and never included Social Security.  When I have been asked by trainers we used in the past about my finances I told them I was receiving disability.  I never said Social Security or what type of income I was receiving,  any assumptions they made about the source was their conclusion and not facilitated by me.  How much I have or how I get it is none of their business.  But I did make the mistake of telling Tom a little too much of my personal life.  So any comments like the one you made are either made out of personal ignorance and bias or made because I mislead you into believing that scenario through our phone conversations.

I should probably change my 100% certain to 99% certain you are Tom Wendt because you did hang with Edward quite a bit.  It's plausible you relayed our conversations to Edward and he drew the same conclusions.  So there is a .99% chance you are Edward.  The other .01% chance would have to be directed towards Eric Ledford or Erv Miller and the chance one of them would waste their time on BTW is less than the chance of repealing recapture.  One last scenario possible is when the old forum crashed or was hacked,  you were able to read my pm's from Joe, TC, and others that I never deleted.  But that scenario brings us back full circle and right back to you TOM.

I read the story on the open forum. That's the unmitigated facts. If it was there four hours 100's of people read it. Sure I'm not the only one who remembers.

Don't remember any public apology or denial afterward. It might have happened. I do remember the original post. That's the danger when people make up hurtful stories about others. People will remember the original phony story or lie but maybe not see what came after. It's what I am trying to get through to you about your Ledford "sugar daddy" story. I don't care about you and your story except as an example. Sounds like someone did you a great wrong.

Always thought Joe makes up a lot of his stories. Thank you for the proof.
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burton
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« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2006, 02:02:58 PM »

Amazing how this thread, which I started ended up being exactly the nonsense I was protesting.
What nonsense!1111
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tonymfan
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« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2006, 02:06:53 PM »

Amazing how this thread, which I started ended up being exactly the nonsense I was protesting.
What nonsense!1111

Four pages of concentrated high power nonsense, and it's far from dead. Right here on the #1 forum in harness racing!!!!!
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swoodall
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« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2006, 02:37:26 PM »

TM'ssinglefan

Janine and Joe can confirm the retraction.  Lets make one thing clear about those posts.  It's wasn't the content of the attacks that cause the problem.  They were logical conclusions based on my appearance made by so many people over the years because of their personal bias towards people with handicaps.  Logical in the sense that they judge the book by it's cover.  I get questions referring to government assistance so much that I just let them believe what they want to believe.  It's not hurtful,  it's laughable!  My response was anger that my father was used as a quotable reference to give credibility to the post.  

The circumstances surrounding that thread does not exist in my thread about being someone's sugar daddy.  I didn't bring a third party into the middle of the fray to give false credibility.  I've known this third party for a long time and trust their credibility 100%.  They know I made the post.  Again,  if you have any relevant information to contradict any post I have made or any member has made on BTW,  then bring it on and make it public!  All you have done is whine like a spoiled 3 year old about personal attacks.  Tom used to do the exact same thing.

These threads and personal information include in these threads are 100% relevant to Illinois Harness Racing.  Unlike your useless dribble,  these threads address the core problems eating at the heart of what little integrity is left in Illinois Harness Racing.  Don't like the content?  Then direct your indignation towards the offenders and help clean up this sport.  You and I know that's not going to happen because you won't attack your buddies.
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swoodall
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« Reply #58 on: April 18, 2006, 02:54:10 PM »

burton

You may be the only one left on this forum with less comprehension then Richard Breath or Ruckerfan and now tony'sbrowneye.  This thread started a discussion about the value and relevance of the posts made on BTW.  You made have started the thread by whining but the 4 pages and counting have stuck to the theme.  I know of another forum that would welcome your sage contributions.  If nothing more then to show that their forum is still alive and kicking.
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tonymfan
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« Reply #59 on: April 18, 2006, 03:10:14 PM »

These threads and personal information include in these threads are 100% relevant to Illinois Harness Racing.  Unlike your useless dribble,  these threads address the core problems eating at the heart of what little integrity is left in Illinois Harness Racing.

The content of your post I objected to has nothing to do with truth and less to do with harness racing.  A harness racing driver's personal life outside the track has nothing to do with "the core problems eating at the heart of what little integrity is left in Illinois Harness Racing."
 
"Could she have been stoned and lying through her teeth?  Absolutely!  Could she have been a stripper trying to cause more trouble for the Ledfrauds?  Possible!  One thing is a fact,  she was real but was her story real?  Any BTW inquiring minds out there in the know on this one?  Someones lost her sugar daddy and needs some consoling!"

What is true in that? What does it have to do with harness racing? The answer to both is nothing.

It's clear you will never admit to the vile rotteness of your posts no matter how wrong you are shown to be. You keep saying it is alright to post untrue garbage like that and like was posted about you. You fight by hanging wrong names on your opponent to deflect attention, claiming vile rotteness like your spew is proper matter for this forum while harness posts are not, and saying your filth is somehow different than other personal attack filth. I'm done with this subject. You and your useless vile rotten posts are going to the ignore bin. Thinking back I can't remember one ever from you that was anything but a vile attack on someone.
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swoodall
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« Reply #60 on: April 19, 2006, 01:37:27 AM »

Ruckerfan

OOPs, I mean tonyms'sphincter.

The Ledfrauds are proven crooks.  Their lack of honesty and integrity extends past the race track including but limited to their marriages.  You have the gall to question another members character while you defend theirs!  Cheating is their way of life,  and whether you like it or not,  their character is relevant.  If a harness driver's personal life is not directly related to his performance on the track,  then why do we drug test them?  Cocaine positives for drivers should be a private matter.  Integrity is not a spigot that can be turned on and off with distinctive boundaries that a driver will not cross. 

A hugh lack of integrity,  as in the Ledfrauds case,  is a symptom of a god complex that they are above reproach and will never get caught.  No matter how sloppy they get with keeping it discreet.  These character flaws are rampant on the backstretch and are the cancer that has brought harness racing in Illinois to it's knees.  You can object or ignore all you want to but when you claim indifference out of one side of your mouth in one thread and then get self rightous out of the other side of your mouth in another thread,  it is you that is exposed as a hypocrite!

The truth is the her existence and Eric is her connection to harness racing.  This whole subject matter is simply another broken cog in the integrity wheel of the Ledfraud operation.  I think potential owners ought to have an opportunity to evaluate a barns entire integrity performance because they do go hand in hand.
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #61 on: April 19, 2006, 01:46:12 AM »

If a harness driver's personal life is not directly related to his performance on the track,  then why do we drug test them?

Drugged drivers danger to racing. Thats professional life not personal. Bad comparison to this argument.
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swoodall
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« Reply #62 on: April 19, 2006, 01:59:57 AM »

Richard

Yes and no.  I completely agree with the driving danger involved but my point was the behavior of the driver in his personal life exposes his mindset and lack of respect for his spouse,  his owners and the betting public.  They are not mutually exclusive.  If a driver doesn't see drug use as off limits then can race fixing,  illegal doping of horses or gambling on other horses in your race from your cell phone in the paddock be far behind?
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edwardwilliam
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« Reply #63 on: April 19, 2006, 05:45:07 PM »

Richard

Yes and no.  I completely agree with the driving danger involved but my point was the behavior of the driver in his personal life exposes his mindset and lack of respect for his spouse,  his owners and the betting public.  They are not mutually exclusive.  If a driver doesn't see drug use as off limits then can race fixing,  illegal doping of horses or gambling on other horses in your race from your cell phone in the paddock be far behind?

Here's the way I see it.

HR would never let a criminal, or a person with a shady past work as a bank teller.  Why?  There's a much higher risk of them "taking from the cookie jar."

Many people tend to forget the IMMENSE amount of money changing hands as a result of this sport.  Even in this largely down time in IL, there's still $8-10M a week wagered, with several million in horseflesh, and another half million in purses.  That's at least TEN MILLION dollars a week of $$ churning in a week.

Do you think morally inept people should be allowed around that kind of cash?

Best,
EW
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Stick to Fantasyland pal, because you'll NEVER make it in the real world - TC
Richard Breth
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« Reply #64 on: April 19, 2006, 11:50:03 PM »

Richard

Yes and no.  I completely agree with the driving danger involved but my point was the behavior of the driver in his personal life exposes his mindset and lack of respect for his spouse,  his owners and the betting public.  They are not mutually exclusive.  If a driver doesn't see drug use as off limits then can race fixing,  illegal doping of horses or gambling on other horses in your race from your cell phone in the paddock be far behind?

Shakey argument. My opinion. Every one that smoked dope in 60s and 70s didnt turned to heroin addict criminals. Trail from strip clubs to cheating at races is more shakey. If strips clubs made criminals TC would be Jeffry Damher. Thay drug test drivers for safety not morals. Thay all ready "check" morals and criminal back ground for racing. Its licenses questions and finger prints.
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swoodall
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« Reply #65 on: April 20, 2006, 03:03:23 AM »

Richard

The checks you listed are really serving the sport well wouldn't you say?  No crooks or shady characters at a race track these days.  Couldn't get past Barney Fife at the front door!  Edward made a great post with sound reasoning.

Using illegal drugs is criminal.  So I'm not sure of your point.  You don't have to be arrested to be criminal.  If you commit an act in violation of the law that is a crime.  I think you are confusing criminal and being a convicted criminal.  Eric was still a criminal before he got caught.  Where is there a morals check point in the licensing process?
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #66 on: April 20, 2006, 11:35:44 PM »

The checks you listed are really serving the sport well wouldn't you say?  No crooks or shady characters at a race track these days.  Couldn't get past Barney Fife at the front door!  Edward made a great post with sound reasoning.

Using illegal drugs is criminal.  So I'm not sure of your point.  You don't have to be arrested to be criminal.  If you commit an act in violation of the law that is a crime.  I think you are confusing criminal and being a convicted criminal.  Eric was still a criminal before he got caught.  Where is there a morals check point in the licensing process?

swoodall your getting far off field.

You wrote drug tests are morals checks in drivers private lifes. No thats bad example I wrote. There safety checks. If state worrys about morals checks of racings people for drugs thay would do every one licensed. Trainers owners racing officials every one. Do thay?

Edward William wrote banks dont hire with bad back grounds. True and mean nothing for this argument. Did you ever hear a bank ask if some one goes to strip clubs? Thay do same thing state licenses does. Asks if you have criminal back grounds. Checks criminal past not strip club past.

If you need argument about racing morals with some one go on. Look hard every one has problem. But drugs tests thay give drivers isnt morals tests or enforcmnent.
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njhorseman
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« Reply #67 on: April 21, 2006, 07:37:15 AM »

If strips clubs made criminals TC would be Jeffry Damher.

You mean he's not?  Grin
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off stride
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« Reply #68 on: April 21, 2006, 09:08:30 AM »

You mean he's not?  Grin
... yep...tc's razor like wit, cuts as sharp and as deep as any other knife on here .. heres to more like him...   
 
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edwardwilliam
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« Reply #69 on: April 21, 2006, 09:53:39 AM »

You wrote drug tests are morals checks in drivers private lifes. No thats bad example I wrote. There safety checks. If state worrys about morals checks of racings people for drugs thay would do every one licensed. Trainers owners racing officials every one. Do thay?

They should.  It's a pretty common practice in the "working world" that nearly all parts involved all subject to drug tests.  Personally, I think it's all the more important with a sport that CENTERS around money.

I think we're all too touchy feely here.  If some driver/trainer/owner has drug problems, beats his wife or kids, has a criminal record, etc -- they should tell him to pound sand.  Just my opinion.  The sport relies too much on the percieved honesty of it's participants to NOT have some sort of moral judgments involved.

Best,
EW
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Stick to Fantasyland pal, because you'll NEVER make it in the real world - TC
off stride
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« Reply #70 on: April 21, 2006, 09:57:03 AM »

we should require the same honesty in the harness game and anal scrutiny, that we require from our politicians ... on  second thought....
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tonymfan
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« Reply #71 on: April 21, 2006, 11:27:40 AM »

If strips clubs made criminals TC would be Jeffry Damher.
You mean he's not?  Grin

I picture him more as the giant Stay Puft marshmallow monster from "Ghostbusters".
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BRINGTHEPAIN
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« Reply #72 on: April 21, 2006, 11:34:46 AM »

STRONG WORDS TOM PEOPLE PICTURE YOU AS TONY MORGANS SPENT RUBBER DRINK UP TOM
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I HATE THE BROWN AND WHITE DEVIL
tonymfan
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« Reply #73 on: April 21, 2006, 11:36:12 AM »

STRONG WORDS TOM PEOPLE PICTURE YOU AS TONY MORGANS SPENT RUBBER DRINK UP TOM

People imagine how you got the name "BRINGTHEPAIN".
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BRINGTHEPAIN
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« Reply #74 on: April 21, 2006, 11:40:54 AM »

BECAUSE I BRINGTHEPAIN ON  rat LIKE U ILL BE AT BAL SAT WHY DONT YOU COME FIND OUT
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I HATE THE BROWN AND WHITE DEVIL
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