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Author Topic: Its Not Just Chicago  (Read 936 times)
poconomike
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« on: March 22, 2006, 02:15:28 PM »

Guys:

Chicago isnt the only place that has seen its harness product go downhill. Has anyone noticed that only 11 of 25 races Fri/Sat at M1 have full 10 horse fields. Unreal
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2006, 05:08:16 PM »

Guys:

Chicago isnt the only place that has seen its harness product go downhill. Has anyone noticed that only 11 of 25 races Fri/Sat at M1 have full 10 horse fields. Unreal

I've noticed it for a long time now. i've been posting that the rcing at the Big M.is not what it once was. The horse quality is going down along with the short fields.
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edwardwilliam
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« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2006, 05:22:12 PM »

I've noticed it for a long time now. i've been posting that the rcing at the Big M.is not what it once was. The horse quality is going down along with the short fields.

Ontario and Delaware have definitely cut into the Big M's piece of the "horse flesh" pie over the past 10 years.  Yonkers and Chester will probably do so even further.

Still -- it remains easily the best harness racing in North America, and probably the best in the World.

Best,
EW

PS- 1994-1998 were awesome though!
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Stick to Fantasyland pal, because you'll NEVER make it in the real world - TC
Dan Nance
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« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2006, 05:27:11 PM »

Ontario and Delaware have definitely cut into the Big M's piece of the "horse flesh" pie over the past 10 years.  Yonkers and Chester will probably do so even further.

Still -- it remains easily the best harness racing in North America, and probably the best in the World.

Best,
EW

PS- 1994-1998 were awesome though!

I'm not too sure about the WORLD, Edward. The United States for sure. I think the racing in Canada is getting better then the Big M.

    If Yonkers and Chester are going to hurt the Big M. what will they do to Chicago racing, put them out of business?

   
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TC
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« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2006, 05:29:18 PM »

Ontario and Delaware have definitely cut into the Big M's piece of the "horse flesh" pie over the past 10 years.  Yonkers and Chester will probably do so even further.

Still -- it remains easily the best harness racing in North America, and probably the best in the World.

Best,
EW

PS- 1994-1998 were awesome though!
Delaware isn't cutting into the Big M much IMO.  The lure of Ontario is strong however (year round big track racing for big  dollar  dollar  dollar).  What is really hurting NJ right now is the fact that several training stalwarts are suspended, missing, moved, etc.  Show me ONE Aussie / Kiwi that's doing well there now.  It seems the fresh supplies of cone snail venom from the Great Barrier Reef have dried up.  This has allowed the Indomethacin Goof Teflon Boy to swoop in and win in droves AND be protected for some insane reason by the NJRC.  I know NJ Paul has explained it rationally, but it's still annoying to see.  Once the EPO tests in NJ come on line, we'll see who remains top dog and who turns to dog doo.   trotter  TC
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edwardwilliam
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« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2006, 06:59:00 PM »

I'm not too sure about the WORLD, Edward. The United States for sure. I think the racing in Canada is getting better then the Big M.

    If Yonkers and Chester are going to hurt the Big M. what will they do to Chicago racing, put them out of business?

   


To me, the racing form Ontario pales in comparison to the Big M.  Rarely do they race that middle half...and although that's somewhat a result of the 7/8ths, I still think the racing falls somewhat behind the Big M.  I do, however, think that the racing at Mohawk is a little better than Wdb.

Still a great circuit though.

Best,
EW
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edwardwilliam
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« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2006, 07:00:56 PM »

Delaware isn't cutting into the Big M much IMO. TC

I don't really think they affect NJ at the higher levels, but there are quite a few lower claimers (15-30) and lower conditioned horses (NW6.5k, etc) that have found their way to DE.  After all, it's about the same money -- for easier -- so I can't blame them.

Yonkers will be the interesting place to watch.  Especially if the rumors like the $50k open are true.

Best,
EW
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TC
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« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2006, 07:26:33 PM »

I don't really think they affect NJ at the higher levels, but there are quite a few lower claimers (15-30) and lower conditioned horses (NW6.5k, etc) that have found their way to DE.  After all, it's about the same money -- for easier -- so I can't blame them.

Yonkers will be the interesting place to watch.  Especially if the rumors like the $50k open are true.

Best,
EW
Who cares ?  It's still 1/2 mile racing presented in an urban sewer.  NEXT !   1/2 mile and 5/8 ths mile racing is a thing of the past IMO and big track racing, offering big fields is where the pools will be deepest, thus better for the player.  I don't care about cherry picking posts draws on the 1/2 or 3 turn races.  The true test is to handicap 10 horse fields where the competition is level and we'll see that...APRIL 1st @ HOOSIER PARK - a place where the arch criminal is given the boot, the inmates are watched, the payoffs are phenomenal, and the purses are more than the Gestapo pays.  10 days and counting laddies.   trotter  TC
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poconomike
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« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2006, 07:41:19 PM »

I dont expect Pennsylvania harness tracks will be a player on the national scene. A couple of weeks ago I was in the crowd for a roundtable discussion of slots in Pa. The panel was comprised of officials from Pocono, Chester, Penn National, and the Erie track. The panel was in complete agreement that the tax rate in Pa 57% as compared to NJ 9% and Nev 6.5% will make it very difficult for casinos to offer the player many amenities. The guy from Harrah's (Chester) was very plainly saying this property is a gateway property for NJ sites. Its funny, because these tracks are GUARANTEED a slots lisense, so they they are being very honest about what they can deliver. The state has still not awarded the non racetrack licenses (5). You should hear those applicants promising the communities this and that. All these promises that the already licensed properties are saying are not possible. Expect Pa racing to mirror Monticello with juicy Pa sire events. thats it
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Armonsol
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« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2006, 07:45:05 PM »

Delaware isn't cutting into the Big M much IMO.  The lure of Ontario is strong however (year round big track racing for big  dollar  dollar  dollar).  What is really hurting NJ right now is the fact that several training stalwarts are suspended, missing, moved, etc.  Show me ONE Aussie / Kiwi that's doing well there now.  It seems the fresh supplies of cone snail venom from the Great Barrier Reef have dried up.  This has allowed the Indomethacin Goof Teflon Boy to swoop in and win in droves AND be protected for some insane reason by the NJRC.  I know NJ Paul has explained it rationally, but it's still annoying to see.  Once the EPO tests in NJ come on line, we'll see who remains top dog and who turns to dog doo.   trotter  TC
It's amazing to me how many times races at the Big M are won by either Ledford or Rucker.  What the hell is going on?  Obviously they are juicing these horses.  These two guys own this place.  And at Balmoral, where every race on a Tuesday is featured on TVG, they run six horse fields This is not a good situation for anybody in this game.  Bettors, owners or trainers.
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poconomike
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« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2006, 07:56:49 PM »

Pocono opens up April 5. They are going 5 days per week with a 230 post...Chester will open Sept 10, they will go three days a week with a 1230 post. Both are looking at slots sometime in late fall
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njhorseman
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« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2006, 09:06:49 PM »

Delaware isn't cutting into the Big M much IMO.  The lure of Ontario is strong however (year round big track racing for big  dollar  dollar  dollar).  What is really hurting NJ right now is the fact that several training stalwarts are suspended, missing, moved, etc.  Show me ONE Aussie / Kiwi that's doing well there now.  It seems the fresh supplies of cone snail venom from the Great Barrier Reef have dried up.  This has allowed the Indomethacin Goof Teflon Boy to swoop in and win in droves AND be protected for some insane reason by the NJRC.  I know NJ Paul has explained it rationally, but it's still annoying to see.  Once the EPO tests in NJ come on line, we'll see who remains top dog and who turns to dog doo.   trotter  TC

TC:

Ross Croghan has made a real comeback. He now is third in wins, only 5 behind Rucker for second place, and he has done it with 115 fewer starts than The Pride of Chicago.  Grin

With Pelling retired, and Daley serving out a 6 month suspension, it's not surprising that the down under star has dimmed.
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