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Author Topic: War Pass Returns  (Read 3611 times)
sawd off
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« on: February 25, 2008, 10:37:09 AM »

What a complete JOKE here on sunday after the Great FOY GII, we got to witness the BC JUV winner make his 2008 debut against a bunch of junk. Its obvious that Gulfstream wrote the race for Zito. The questions remains who paid the other entrants to run? It was just a public paid workout for him and Zito is leaning going to the Tampabay Derby for his next start. I guess if he does go to Tampa there is some real fools at Gulfstream park. Embarrassed
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mel4600
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« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2008, 01:21:32 PM »

It won't matter where he goes next. I have not seen a horse who I can say will seriously challenge him yet. He did have a paid work under firm hold and would have won the the FOY easily.
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glahn
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« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2008, 04:47:59 PM »

It won't matter where he goes next. I have not seen a horse who I can say will seriously challenge him yet. He did have a paid work under firm hold and would have won the the FOY easily.

He still doesn't look like a horse that'll get a mile and a quarter to me. Not to mention his breeding.
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Earl Sande
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« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2008, 04:54:37 PM »

Look at his past performance lines, this horse will NEVER go ten furlongs.
Great job of ducking the competition by Zito, it pads his record and people will keep talking about him as long as he is undefeated.
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glahn
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« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2008, 05:23:27 PM »

Well, I'd say look at his pace figures and watch his races. He's got too much speed and doesn't come home very strongly. An extra 2f is going to be a problem unless they somehow get him to ration his speed more efficiently. And I don't think he'll "naturally" do this as the distances get longer.
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mel4600
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« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2008, 05:49:02 PM »

Well, I'd say look at his pace figures and watch his races. He's got too much speed and doesn't come home very strongly. An extra 2f is going to be a problem unless they somehow get him to ration his speed more efficiently. And I don't think he'll "naturally" do this as the distances get longer.

You may be correct, however, the horse will let us know. Who is better than him right now?
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glahn
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« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2008, 06:06:03 PM »

You may be correct, however, the horse will let us know. Who is better than him right now?

At a mile? Certainly no three year old in America. Probably no older horse either. In the slop between a mile and a mile and an eighth? Maybe no one. At a mile and a quarter on a fast track, we don't know but can only make an educated guess.
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mottoman
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« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2008, 06:52:43 PM »

I ventured to the NTRA site to view free replays and War pass is in a class by himself right now, but I would not say he is going to win the Derby yet!!!!  But I am impressed and I don't get impressed that easily as I have seen many good ones come and go!!!!
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mel4600
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« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2008, 08:41:51 AM »

I ventured to the NTRA site to view free replays and War pass is in a class by himself right now, but I would not say he is going to win the Derby yet!!!!  But I am impressed and I don't get impressed that easily as I have seen many good ones come and go!!!!

mottoman,

That's the way I see it. If he improves at all as a 3 year old he will be tough to deal with. I wish he had run in the FOY, however, the connections must have wanted him to get a race under his belt. It would have been nice to see how he would have done at a 1 1/8 mile distance.
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sawd off
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« Reply #9 on: February 26, 2008, 03:01:11 PM »

You may be correct, however, the horse will let us know. Who is better than him right now?
Can you say PYRO! I know he beat him last year but when it comes to a mile and a quarter no contest who will get the distance and I will have to say right now PYRO is better.
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mel4600
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« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2008, 03:31:01 PM »

Can you say PYRO! I know he beat him last year but when it comes to a mile and a quarter no contest who will get the distance and I will have to say right now PYRO is better.

Pyro did look good in his last race and impressed me very much, however, the beyer fig was low. Pyro is 0 for 3 against War Pass so far. War Pass beat him the first time they raced at 6 furlongs by 6 3/4 lengths. The second time they raced he beat him at a mile by 1 1/2 length's. The 3rd time they met was a 1 1/16 miles and Was pass beat him by 4 1/2 length's while Pyro beat the 3rd place finisher by another 12 length's. It sure looks to me that the farther he went the better he ran and he received a 113 beyer fig and I never remember any 2 year old ever receiving anything close to that.

If you want to make an even wager right now, horse against horse I will be glad to oblige you the first time they meet at a 1 1/4 mile distance.
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sawd off
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« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2008, 04:28:48 PM »

Pyro did look good in his last race and impressed me very much, however, the beyer fig was low. Pyro is 0 for 3 against War Pass so far. War Pass beat him the first time they raced at 6 furlongs by 6 3/4 lengths. The second time they raced he beat him at a mile by 1 1/2 length's. The 3rd time they met was a 1 1/16 miles and Was pass beat him by 4 1/2 length's while Pyro beat the 3rd place finisher by another 12 length's. It sure looks to me that the farther he went the better he ran and he received a 113 beyer fig and I never remember any 2 year old ever receiving anything close to that.

If you want to make an even wager right now, horse against horse I will be glad to oblige you the first time they meet at a 1 1/4 mile distance.
If they both run in the Derby then I will take that wager.
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glahn
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« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2008, 06:24:43 PM »

Pyro did look good in his last race and impressed me very much, however, the beyer fig was low. Pyro is 0 for 3 against War Pass so far. War Pass beat him the first time they raced at 6 furlongs by 6 3/4 lengths. The second time they raced he beat him at a mile by 1 1/2 length's. The 3rd time they met was a 1 1/16 miles and Was pass beat him by 4 1/2 length's while Pyro beat the 3rd place finisher by another 12 length's. It sure looks to me that the farther he went the better he ran and he received a 113 beyer fig and I never remember any 2 year old ever receiving anything close to that.

If you want to make an even wager right now, horse against horse I will be glad to oblige you the first time they meet at a 1 1/4 mile distance.

$50 on who has the higher placing in the Derby provided the track is labeled "wet-fast" or better.

Also, the 1 1/16th race is questionable given that it was a bog. If you look at the other two races: 6f, margin of 4 lengths; 1 mile, margin of 1 length. What does this tell you?
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NIATROSS
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« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2008, 06:36:45 PM »

$50 on who has the higher placing in the Derby provided the track is labeled "wet-fast" or better.

Also, the 1 1/16th race is questionable given that it was a bog. If you look at the other two races: 6f, margin of 4 lengths; 1 mile, margin of 1 length. What does this tell you?

It tells me the best horse won no matter the margin.I would like some of that action if avaiable.
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mel4600
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« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2008, 07:30:49 PM »

$50 on who has the higher placing in the Derby provided the track is labeled "wet-fast" or better.

Also, the 1 1/16th race is questionable given that it was a bog. If you look at the other two races: 6f, margin of 4 lengths; 1 mile, margin of 1 length. What does this tell you?

I will be glad to make any wager with you on these 2 horses. I want confirmation that someone on this board knows both of us. Janine knows who I am and where I sit at the track. Give her confirmation as to who you are and she can collect the bet from both of us with the understanding that if either of us welsh she has permission to disclose identity.

You asked me what the races told me? It tells me that War Pass was a superior horse as a 2 year old at any distance.
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mel4600
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« Reply #15 on: February 26, 2008, 07:32:33 PM »

If they both run in the Derby then I will take that wager.

You're on! See the rules for glan and name your price for confirmation.
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glahn
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« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2008, 07:39:37 PM »

I will be glad to make any wager with you on these 2 horses. I want confirmation that someone on this board knows both of us. Janine knows who I am and where I sit at the track. Give her confirmation as to who you are and she can collect the bet from both of us with the understanding that if either of us welsh she has permission to disclose identity.

You asked me what the races told me? It tells me that War Pass was a superior horse as a 2 year old at any distance.

I'm not giving out my full name to anyone on this board. If I lose the bet you can be assured that I'll pay you in person at AP. I would expect the same from you. We can then chat about that day's card. I just hope you don't have any goons on hand to kill me when one of us pays up (see earlier threads re: death threats, heh heh).

I think this of more of a friendly-type wager, and actually I kind of like "head to head" bets, although not with a ridiculous takeout.
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mel4600
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« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2008, 07:51:07 PM »

I'm not giving out my full name to anyone on this board. If I lose the bet you can be assured that I'll pay you in person at AP. I would expect the same from you. We can then chat about that day's card. I just hope you don't have any goons on hand to kill me when one of us pays up (see earlier threads re: death threats, heh heh).

I think this of more of a friendly-type wager, and actually I kind of like "head to head" bets, although not with a ridiculous takeout.

I'll accept you at your word, you're on.
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NIATROSS
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« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2008, 07:21:16 PM »

Since I cannot get any takers can I go partners with you Mel ?

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mel4600
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« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2008, 09:40:41 PM »

Since I cannot get any takers can I go partners with you Mel ?



I would except I might need it to pay you off on the Celtics. I was laughing when we made that bet and everything reversed on me.  thumbs up
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The Commander
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« Reply #20 on: February 27, 2008, 09:41:30 PM »

i'm confused.

What is the wager?

Who is on each side?
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mel4600
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« Reply #21 on: February 27, 2008, 09:52:24 PM »

i'm confused.

What is the wager?

Who is on each side?

I have $50 straight up with glahn if they meet in the Derby. I also bet sawd off except I'm waiting on the wager amount.
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NIATROSS
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« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2008, 10:14:05 AM »

I would except I might need it to pay you off on the Celtics. I was laughing when we made that bet and everything reversed on me.  thumbs up

At this point I am so sure of the War Pass wager I would be your partner at no risk to you.I will wait until late April with the offer.
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The Commander
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« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2008, 11:17:37 AM »

At this point I am so sure of the War Pass wager I would be your partner at no risk to you.I will wait until late April with the offer.

Niatross and Mel,

Are you super confident that War Pass will beat Pyro or super confident that War Pass will win the debry? 

I think War Pass is a great horse but just can't see him holding on for 10 furlongs.
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NIATROSS
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« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2008, 11:32:23 AM »

Niatross and Mel,

Are you super confident that War Pass will beat Pyro or super confident that War Pass will win the debry? 

I think War Pass is a great horse but just can't see him holding on for 10 furlongs.

I am confident of him beating PYRO in the Derby.PYRO has not yet finished ahead of him at any distance.I will not decide my Derby selection until May.
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The Commander
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« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2008, 11:46:48 AM »

I am confident of him beating PYRO in the Derby.PYRO has not yet finished ahead of him at any distance.I will not decide my Derby selection until May.


That is fair. I kind of feel the same way. Pyro has had 3 shots and really hasn't been close.
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glahn
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« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2008, 07:37:03 PM »

Mel, if you want to make another bet, and are interested in Derby futures, I'll give you 1 tick better than pool #2 (i.e if he settles at 5-1, I'll give you 6-1). But we'd need to keep the size small.
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mel4600
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« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2008, 09:00:30 PM »

Niatross and Mel,

Are you super confident that War Pass will beat Pyro or super confident that War Pass will win the debry? 

I think War Pass is a great horse but just can't see him holding on for 10 furlongs.

Commander,

Steve agrees with you and I have already bet him. Pyro looked great in his last race and I question the caliber of horse he ran against when it was a crawling pace and the front runners could not go on. Any 2 year old that can get a 113 beyer fig at 1 1/16 miles is something special. I have to see someone beat him.
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mel4600
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« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2008, 09:02:51 PM »

Mel, if you want to make another bet, and are interested in Derby futures, I'll give you 1 tick better than pool #2 (i.e if he settles at 5-1, I'll give you 6-1). But we'd need to keep the size small.

Is the bet cancelled if he does not run in the Derby? If it is let me know how large a wager your willing take and I will decide on the amount.  beer
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The Commander
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« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2008, 09:41:51 PM »

Commander,

Steve agrees with you and I have already bet him. Pyro looked great in his last race and I question the caliber of horse he ran against when it was a crawling pace and the front runners could not go on. Any 2 year old that can get a 113 beyer fig at 1 1/16 miles is something special. I have to see someone beat him.

I agree with you Mel. The 113 beyer is super impressive, I put alot of weighting on beyers when making my derby choice(s). In addition, Pyro has had 3 shots at War Pass with no luck.
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glahn
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« Reply #30 on: February 29, 2008, 06:25:03 AM »

Is the bet cancelled if he does not run in the Derby? If it is let me know how large a wager your willing take and I will decide on the amount.  beer

Of course not! Otherwise it wouldn't be a proper futures bet, heh heh.

But this raise a good point. The head-to-head bet is only good if both horses run in the Derby, right?
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mel4600
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« Reply #31 on: February 29, 2008, 09:59:06 AM »

Of course not! Otherwise it wouldn't be a proper futures bet, heh heh.

But this raise a good point. The head-to-head bet is only good if both horses run in the Derby, right?

I'll let you make the call. I'm game for every race they run as 3 year olds. Let me know.
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glahn
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« Reply #32 on: March 01, 2008, 09:10:00 AM »

I'll let you make the call. I'm game for every race they run as 3 year olds. Let me know.


Yeah, only if they both leave the starting gate at the Derby.
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mel4600
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« Reply #33 on: March 01, 2008, 09:28:38 AM »


Yeah, only if they both leave the starting gate at the Derby.

Derby only it is for $50. Good luck.
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« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2008, 08:32:48 AM »

There are ONLY two serious contenders for the derby this year.

WAR PASS speed vs PYRO close. No one else even in the picture. :-)

I'd give the edge to WAR PASS. But PYRO will make him work for it.
However I'd take the speed hoss here. And for those who say he doesn't have the pedigree
to make 10F neither did Smarty. LOL.

Speed kills. :-)

CBA
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Kickers beat one-pacers almost every time.
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« Reply #35 on: March 11, 2008, 03:08:29 PM »

Only two other horses are entered in The Tampa Derby. How is that for ducking and dodging?
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glahn
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« Reply #36 on: March 11, 2008, 04:26:29 PM »

There are ONLY two serious contenders for the derby this year.

WAR PASS speed vs PYRO close. No one else even in the picture. :-)

I'd give the edge to WAR PASS. But PYRO will make him work for it.
However I'd take the speed hoss here. And for those who say he doesn't have the pedigree
to make 10F neither did Smarty. LOL.

Speed kills. :-)

CBA


I don't think this year is as clear cut as last year was, when the only contenders for the win were, in my opinion, Street Sense and Curlin.
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big wally
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« Reply #37 on: March 11, 2008, 09:04:19 PM »

Only two other horses are entered in The Tampa Derby. How is that for ducking and dodging?

According to this article more will be entered ,,, bridge Jumpers will be out in full force
 
Brandon Benson/NYRA photo
by Jeff Lowe

Whirlaway Stakes winner Barrier Reef will not participate Saturday’s Tampa Bay Derby (G3) after missing a few days of training at Payson Park due to a minor injury.

“He grabbed himself behind coming off the track the other day in the mud,” said Rick Mettee, the United States assistant to Godolphin Racing trainer Saeed bin Suroor. “It’s nothing serious—he’s going back to the track [on Wednesday]—but he missed his scheduled workout the other day. I spoke with Saeed, and he said ‘Let’s just pass this race.’”

Mettee said no decision has been made on an alternative race for Barrier Reef, who was transferred to Godolphin after his victory in the Whirlaway on February 2 at Aqueduct for owner Darley Stable.

Barrier Reef was not among the early nominees for the Triple Crown. The late nomination deadline is March 29.

The defection leaves Atoned and Big Truck as perhaps the leading rivals for champion War Pass in the 1 1/16-mile Tampa Bay Derby. Atoned has not raced since his second-place finish in the Remsen Stakes (G2) on November 24. Big Truck finished second in the Sam F. Davis Stakes at Tampa Bay on February 16.

Stakes coordinator Duane Christo said local horses Dynamic Wayne, Gentleman James, and Song of Greatness are likely for the Tampa Bay Derby. Cigar Man, Golden Spikes, and Stormin Yank also could join the field.

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