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Author Topic: Today's Daily Debate Question for Tuesday, January 10th  (Read 2453 times)
Richard Breth
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« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2006, 03:16:10 PM »

I don't know. Call Woodbine and ask them, then report back to us what they said.

They probably monitor this site like every one. Means they saw your idea a long time ago and didnt use it. For some reason.
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2006, 03:23:25 PM »



     My theory for wanting a change in venues and having different tracks hosting the different breeds is a simple one. Presently in Illinois, Arlington has a stranglehold of the premier Thoroughbred dates while Balmoral/Maywood has the same death-grip on the Harness dates. This creates an unfair monopoly, in my opinion. Maybe it's me, but don't you guys get tired of racing at the same place all of the time? And how about the fans, should a die-hard fan that lives near Arlington Park be forced to have to drive all the way to Balmoral to see a live product? Of course he could attend an OTB but that does nothing for the business.

     The way the dates are allocated in Illinois is disturbing because it’s virtually the same one-trick-pony-show. I love variety and challenges. The way the current schedule is done, there is no way possible to attract new fans or betting interest. I live in Crete and certainly would never buy a Thoroughbred if I had to drive down to Arlington every time my horse was in to race. That is my point of this whole debate. The downward spiral harness racing has experienced in the last 5 years should tell all of us that something is drastically wrong. I know as Dan *** pointed out that the Meadowlands races for 9 months straight over the same surface, mostly the same horses and trainer/drivers, BUT, look at where the Meadowlands is located. That is one of many reasons why they have become the premiere harness track and are so successful. Location, location, location, that is a major stepping stone of any successful business. Let's be honest, Balmoral and Maywood are not very easily accessible for city folks, especially Balmoral.

     Think about this; how many people that live in Chicago would actually say to themselves, "I feel like going to the track tonight, let me drive an hour to Crete." Those same people might have a change of heart if Hawthorne or Sportsman's Parks were running. We are never going to attract any new fans into the sport by racing at Balmoral unless they live way south of the city and somewhere close to the area. The expose is very limited at Balmoral, in my opinion. It is a sin that a city the size of Chicago does not have a harness track within close proximity. Just my opinion and keep your ideas coming in, we might just get this thing turned around after all.

Best Regards,
Joseph M .Dakuras
(A UNLV Runnin Rebel For Life)


Joe
         I often wondered why they ever thought that Balmoral was going to become a " premier " racetrack when it is located so far out in the boondocks that nobody in the city of Chicago would want to drive that far to see live racing. I think it was in the gestapo's plans to buy Balmoral because they knew it was so far out in the boondocks that most people would go to their nearest OTB to attend the races where they make way more money then if the fans would be betting at the track. Think about it, who in their right mind would buy a track as old as Balmoral (Fox Fields) with all the code violations and a barn area that is a complete fire trap not to mention how BRUTAL and DARK those barns are on the backside.

        I really think it is starting to " backfire " on the Johnston's and the other owners of Balmoral Park. The place is a complete dump with it's 1968 grandstand windows that are as filthy as Mitch's colors. I can see someday the Johnston's calling in an arsonist to burn the whole place down so that maybe they can sell the land and rebuild a new track on a nice piece of land somewhere in the city where racing should be conducted.

        Personally, I think they should rebuild Sportsman's Park into a premier harness and t-bred track with slots and gaming. They don't need another mall with Walmart or Kmart.

P.S.
      Is the " Double Drive-In " still there on the corner?
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TC
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« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2006, 03:28:14 PM »


 

P.S.
      Is the " Double Drive-In " still there on the corner?

Dan, I think the drive-in is kaput.  If it is open, it's showing "Tortilla Soup" and "O Dios Mio" as a double feature.  Wink  TC
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2006, 03:30:20 PM »

It would be nice to see the t-breds race at Balmoral Park in Jan. & Feb. so they can get their ass off the backside of Hawthorne so the harness can have their winter dates back at Hawthorne in Jan. & Feb.   

Hawthorne gets January and Febuary day simulcats money during Santa Anita Fair Grounds Gulfstream season. Febuary as host. Probaly more money in that than night time harness.
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John Doe
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« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2006, 05:52:43 PM »

Hawthorne gets January and Febuary day simulcats money during Santa Anita Fair Grounds Gulfstream season. Febuary as host. Probaly more money in that than night time harness.

Richard:

     I somewhat agree with what you said about Hawthorne getting the good daytime simulcast money for January and February, but I find it hard to believe that their simulcasting money would be equal to or greater than a live harness card that included double-headers. Maybe more than a night time harness card and even then, I seriously doubt it. Remember, not that long ago Hawthorne was handling huge money on their double-header cards. Just my opinion however and I could be wrong.

     I would just love to see a change of venues for one year to see what the results would be. I really think it would help both breeds.

Best regards,
Joseph M. Dakuras
(A UNLV Runnin Rebel For Life)
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2006, 07:23:23 PM »

Richard:

     I somewhat agree with what you said about Hawthorne getting the good daytime simulcast money for January and February, but I find it hard to believe that their simulcasting money would be equal to or greater than a live harness card that included double-headers. Maybe more than a night time harness card and even then, I seriously doubt it. Remember, not that long ago Hawthorne was handling huge money on their double-header cards. Just my opinion however and I could be wrong.

     I would just love to see a change of venues for one year to see what the results would be. I really think it would help both breeds.

Best regards,
Joseph M. Dakuras
(A UNLV Runnin Rebel For Life)


Joe
        No kind of racing is going to help Balmoral Park. The place is too far out in the boondocks and it is old and it's nothing but a dump. You can't even sit inside the grandstand and see the races good because the windows are so dirty.

        Also, Balmoral doesn't have a good track crew that can maintain the racing surface. They would have so many t-breds breaking down with the track crew they have working now that the t-bred trainers would be crying the blues. 
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Kenneth J. Chadwick
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« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2006, 07:43:58 PM »

Richard:

     I somewhat agree with what you said about Hawthorne getting the good daytime simulcast money for January and February, but I find it hard to believe that their simulcasting money would be equal to or greater than a live harness card that included double-headers. Maybe more than a night time harness card and even then, I seriously doubt it. Remember, not that long ago Hawthorne was handling huge money on their double-header cards. Just my opinion however and I could be wrong.

     I would just love to see a change of venues for one year to see what the results would be. I really think it would help both breeds.

Best regards,
Joseph M. Dakuras
(A UNLV Runnin Rebel For Life)

The above is Joe's quote and I used it as a reference.
I don't know how to use a quote and then comment and reference with my post.
Need the administrator help. Shocked Shocked

Dear Group:

I like the questions that are being posted.


I enjoy racing, but the trip to Crete is 90 miles and therefore I don't attend many live racing programs a year.  Maybe 6 at the most.

Whereas when Hawthorne is running I am at the track 2/3 days a week.
I enjoy the racing at Hawthorne.
It's closer and I get home at a reasonable hour, especially on Sunday night.

I know this is a reach, but I wonder if the Churchill people thought about running a harness program at AP.  At one time they had dates and they ran at Maywood.  Does anyone have any idea about the economics what the tracks need in handle to make decent money in the business.

As a side bar, I noticed that Hawthorne had a very good handle for the T-Breds even though much of the money was from out-of-state.


Kenneth J. Chadwick
« Last Edit: January 10, 2006, 07:47:25 PM by Kenneth J. Chadwick » Report to moderator   Logged

It's a Wonderful Life, let's live every moment like its your last.
Richard Breth
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« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2006, 07:56:08 PM »

I somewhat agree with what you said about Hawthorne getting the good daytime simulcast money for January and February, but I find it hard to believe that their simulcasting money would be equal to or greater than a live harness card that included double-headers. Maybe more than a night time harness card and even then, I seriously doubt it. Remember, not that long ago Hawthorne was handling huge money on their double-header cards. Just my opinion however and I could be wrong.

A poster pointed out when Hawthorne had big winter doubleheader handle it was the only thing in Chicago to bet day or night. Things change since then especialy fullcard. Why would it do better then Balmoral now.

Simulcats is the big money now not live anyhow. IRB report says January Febuary money for tbreds daytime is almost $50 millions per month thats simulcast only no live meet costs. Night time live plus simulcats is only $30 millions per month. What would you want if you ran the track?    

Never saw Hawthorne ask to get winter dates back either.
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Les Moore
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« Reply #33 on: January 11, 2006, 01:03:31 AM »

Drastic times call for drastic measures. Michigan Dale is on to something here. Since racing lost many patrons to casinos because of the fast paced action, how about running a harness race followed by a greyhound race to keep the action rolling. I know many die hard harness fans would hate the idea but think of betting into decent greyhound pools for a change.
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