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Author Topic: NOW THAT THE STRIKE IS OVER THE HORSEMAN SHOULD......  (Read 5775 times)
Dan Nance
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« on: January 05, 2006, 10:49:27 PM »

All stand behind Joe Dakuras and demand that he be allowed to race and train again at Balmoral.

    If Rucker can get off with 6 positives then there is no reason why Joe shouldn't be allowed to train horses and race them in Chicago.

    While he's in law school he still can find the time to train a few head because after all his first love in life is racing horses. Because of a few evil people he was stripped of his right to participate.
   
    It's makes no sense to me that guys like Rucker and Joe (the knife) can race but Joe Dakuras can't when he never had a positive test. I would claim 2 horses in a heartbeat and give them to Joe to train because the guy knows what he's doing and I know unlike Ledford I could trust him not to lie to me.

    So, come on horseman if you want to do the right thing for one of your fellow horseman get a petition together and demand that Joe be allowed to race again. It's not guys like Joe Dakuras that are going to hurt you, it's the other cheaters you really have to worry about.   
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2006, 11:37:26 PM »

61 views so far and not one post saying " yeah I'll back Joe ". What's wrong, don't want to back Joe because you're afraid you might land in the gestapo's dog house?
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swoodall
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« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2006, 12:28:46 AM »

Dan

You said "It's not guys like Joe Dakuras are going to hurt you,  IT'S THE OTHER CHEATERS...!!!  Are you saying Joe is a cheater but on a smaller scale than Rucker or Anderson?
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PONYBOY
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« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2006, 12:41:15 AM »

61 views so far and not one post saying " yeah I'll back Joe ". What's wrong, don't want to back Joe because you're afraid you might land in the gestapo's dog house?
THE ONLY JOE THAT SHOULD BE BACKED IN THIS BUSINESS BOYS, IS JOE ANDERSON.  HE MADE RACING FANS COME OUT TO THE TRACK AGAIN.  AND HE'S STILL THE BEST!  HE DOESN'T HIDE IN AN OTB ALL DAY.  HE'S AT THE BARN MAKING CHAMPIONS.  YOU SHOULD ALL THANK HIM JUST TO BE ABLE TO WATCH THE GUY OUT ON THE TRACK IS LIKE WATCHING JOE MONTANA WORKING HIS MAGIC OUT ON THE FIELD.  ONE DAY JOE (TENNESSEE); JOE THAT IS, SHOULD OPEN A FANTASY CAMP AND YOU CRY-BABIES PAY A FEE JUST TO HANG OUT WITH HIM!!!  GET OVER IT OR GET BACK IN IT AND LET'S JUST SEE IF YOU COULD EVEN COMPETE AT A LEVEL WITH GUYS LIKE ANDERSON, RUCKER, OR PLETCHER!! Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry
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Armonsol
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« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2006, 12:49:09 AM »

THE ONLY JOE THAT SHOULD BE BACKED IN THIS BUSINESS BOYS, IS JOE ANDERSON.  HE MADE RACING FANS COME OUT TO THE TRACK AGAIN.  AND HE'S STILL THE BEST!  HE DOESN'T HIDE IN AN OTB ALL DAY.  HE'S AT THE BARN MAKING CHAMPIONS.  YOU SHOULD ALL THANK HIM JUST TO BE ABLE TO WATCH THE GUY OUT ON THE TRACK IS LIKE WATCHING JOE MONTANA WORKING HIS MAGIC OUT ON THE FIELD.  ONE DAY JOE (TENNESSEE); JOE THAT IS, SHOULD OPEN A FANTASY CAMP AND YOU CRY-BABIES PAY A FEE JUST TO HANG OUT WITH HIM!!!  GET OVER IT OR GET BACK IN IT AND LET'S JUST SEE IF YOU COULD EVEN COMPETE AT A LEVEL WITH GUYS LIKE ANDERSON, RUCKER, OR PLETCHER!! Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry Cry

Oh BROTHER.  Joe Anderson = Joe Montana?   This is comparing apples and manhole covers.  If the horsemen are glad the strike is over, then so am I.  I can't wait to see Big Head Hundreds again maybe twice a week.........
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swoodall
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« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2006, 01:07:57 AM »

Everyone I know in or from Tennessee is either a drug addict or drug manufacturer(meth these days) so don't use Tennessee as a nick name or as a compliment anymore.  It's not the same great place it use to be!  I know,  I grew up most of my youth there and my last visit over Thanksgiving was sickening.  Tennessee leads the country in Meth production,  meth lab busts and children in state custody because of drug addicted parents being incarcerated at alarming rates.  This was on the front page of the Tennessean Newspaper the Friday after Thanksgiving.  So Joe being a master chemist with horses was no suprise to me.  Rural Franklin County had already made 44 meth lab busts as of Nov.1st.  It's an epidemic!  I want Joe to pee in a bottle at this fantasy camp and send it in for testing.  The apple never falls too far from the tree.
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twinkiethekid
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« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2006, 02:13:48 AM »

WILL YOU BE GIVING JOE D THE SAME M99 THAT YOU AND SCOTT USED TO LIGHT THEM UP? JOE D AINT A BAD GUY BUT HE IS BETTER OFF STAYING IN LAW SCHOOL. HE WILL NEED THAT LAW DEGREE TO BAIL THE CHEATIN HORSEMEN OUT WHEN THEY GO TO CHEATIN!!! YOU BETTER ASK JOE D IF YOU CAN USE HIS NAME ON HERE OR HE MIGHT FILE A LAWSUIT AGINST YOU. BE HONEST DAN, JOE D COULD CHEAT WITH THE BEST OF THEM IN HIS DAY. I SAW HIM STIFF A HORSE FOR 3 MONTHS STRAIGHT  AND THEN CASH BIGGGGGGG. THE STEAWRDS MUST HAVE BEEN BLIND BECAUSE YOU COULD SEE THE HORSES NECK BEING TWISTED ALL THE WAY DOWN THE STRETCH AND SUDDENLY, OH HE JUST FALLS SHORT AND ENDS UP IN SECOND PLACE. I SEEN IT TIME AFTER TIME. HES NO ANGEL BUT SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO RACE IMO. JOE ALWAYS HAD A TRICK OR TWO UP HIS SLEEVE AND WAS PRETTY SLICK ABOUT IT. I AINT SAYIN NOTHING BAD ABOUT EITHER OF YOU GUYS BUT I THINK BOTH JOE AND YOU ARE BETTER OFF THAN RACING FOR THE CHEAP PURSES AS YOU PUT IT!!!I AM JUST HAPPY TO BE BACK RACING AND MAKING MONEY. THE STRIKE IS OVER SO ITS BACK TO WORK. NICE XMAS PRESENT FOR ALL OF THE HORSEMEN!!
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john
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« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2006, 02:59:50 AM »

I will back joe dakuras. He has a great passion and should be allowed to
Train horses. I'll send you a horse if you can get me some colorado river toads. Dan are these toads to be eaten or kept as pets Huh?
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TC
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« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2006, 10:57:48 AM »

Let's set the record straight...Joe Dakuras is NOT suspended.  Joe has a valid racing license in Ontario and enter 100 head there if he wishes.  Joe had a beef with the Gestapo over their refusal to accept his entries.  That all played out in arbitration.  Johnnie Johnston himself told Joe over the holidays to come in to his office ANYTIME to discuss his options at Maywood and Balmoral - FACT.  Joe Parisi, Mr. Dakuras' attorney, has been informed by Mr. Laino that Joe is welcome to reapply ANYTIME.  I sat at the meeting Tuesday next to John McCarthy, a prominent owner and he even was misled as to the status of Mr. Dakuras.  Joe felt it was unjust that he was stopped for a matter of time doing what he loved to do - train (and drive) horses. 

  On a personal note, I find Joe to be a nice guy who would give you the shirt (or UNLV jersey - LOL) off his back if he could.  I'm proud to call him a friend.  We don't go back a long way, but I really value his opinions on this forum and I support his goal to pursue a better life through higher education.  Shame on anyone who disrespects a person's attempt to make a better life for themselves.  Good luck to him next semester and I hope one day to have him represent me in a legal matter.  Joe may never end up an Ivy League Phi Beta Kappa, but with his education complete, his passion, and his savvy, I know I'll be getting an advocate (lawyer) on my side.  TC
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Big C
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« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2006, 11:11:56 AM »

The only difference between Rucker and Dakuras is that JD never had  the amount of horses to train otherwise he'd have had just as many POSITIVES! Be real, JD was a REAL THIEF. Lets see, Joe Dakuras atty. Now think about that. Aren't many (not all) attys scum?
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off stride
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« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2006, 11:22:23 AM »

Lets see, Joe Dakuras atty. Now think about that. Aren't many (not all) attys scum?

?what do you call 1000 atty's  buried in the bottom of the sea???
Aa good start
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abtruth
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« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2006, 11:46:56 AM »

lawyers are evil sure right up intil you need one.my lawyer saved me from buying a farm with 3 leens on it.i raced with dakuras in 2000 and 2001 and never saw him load one and my row was across from his.ruckers and anderson is big time joe was a champion of us littler guys.i got no problem with him.i was happy to see him at the meeting and he got as much to say as dummys who got up and looked dumb talkin about slots that aint goona get here becuse of old man billy johnson the sob.now that were back racin i say get rid of the big crooks now.you know who you are.truth
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2006, 12:49:29 PM »

WILL YOU BE GIVING JOE D THE SAME M99 THAT YOU AND SCOTT USED TO LIGHT THEM UP? JOE D AINT A BAD GUY BUT HE IS BETTER OFF STAYING IN LAW SCHOOL. HE WILL NEED THAT LAW DEGREE TO BAIL THE CHEATIN HORSEMEN OUT WHEN THEY GO TO CHEATIN!!! YOU BETTER ASK JOE D IF YOU CAN USE HIS NAME ON HERE OR HE MIGHT FILE A LAWSUIT AGINST YOU. BE HONEST DAN, JOE D COULD CHEAT WITH THE BEST OF THEM IN HIS DAY. I SAW HIM STIFF A HORSE FOR 3 MONTHS STRAIGHT  AND THEN CASH BIGGGGGGG. THE STEAWRDS MUST HAVE BEEN BLIND BECAUSE YOU COULD SEE THE HORSES NECK BEING TWISTED ALL THE WAY DOWN THE STRETCH AND SUDDENLY, OH HE JUST FALLS SHORT AND ENDS UP IN SECOND PLACE. I SEEN IT TIME AFTER TIME. HES NO ANGEL BUT SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO RACE IMO. JOE ALWAYS HAD A TRICK OR TWO UP HIS SLEEVE AND WAS PRETTY SLICK ABOUT IT. I AINT SAYIN NOTHING BAD ABOUT EITHER OF YOU GUYS BUT I THINK BOTH JOE AND YOU ARE BETTER OFF THAN RACING FOR THE CHEAP PURSES AS YOU PUT IT!!!I AM JUST HAPPY TO BE BACK RACING AND MAKING MONEY. THE STRIKE IS OVER SO ITS BACK TO WORK. NICE XMAS PRESENT FOR ALL OF THE HORSEMEN!!

Sorry Charlie, hate to disappoint you but I never used M99. Looking back now I sure wish I had because I should have been the biggest cheater around and filled my pockets with nothing but cash like Rucker does. It pays off in this business to cheat your ass off and make as much money as you can instead of being Joe Honest and grow old and busted like 80% of the horseman are. Whatever money was made off M99 was made by Dennis Bowen and Dr. Paul Steinmeyer because they were the ones who knew they had some bustout groom working for us who was hitting Bowens horses behind our back. Bowen took the money he made and snorted it up his noise and Steinmeyer no doubt spent his money trying to get himself out of debt. Well, good for them. Bowen is dead now (probably from too much coke up his noise) and who knows where Steinmeyer is.

    Talk about setting horses up, there was no one better at that then the Redman himself. Go have a conversation someday with Dean Collins and he'll fill you in on that operation. And talk about M99? The Redman and the white haired guy from down under made so much money in the summer of 1983 off that shit they might be still spending the money.

    I need some hard core proof before I start believing someone is a crook and a cheat. I don't listen to hearsay or rumors about someone and lable that person no good. I don't ever recall seeing anything posted on the board in the racing office that Joe Dakuras cheated in a race. Nor have I seen any suspension's posted in the racing office with Joe's name on them.

    On the other hand I did see proof the Rucker has had MANY positive tests over the last several years. And the same goes for Joe (the knife). So, that proves to me that they are big time cheaters.

     We all know that Joe can get a Illinois Racing Board license but the fact is that the Johnston's are keeping him from racing at their tracks. They spent $60,000 fighting to keep him out so why would anyone think they would now let him back. I believe when a horseman is BLACKBALLED all the other horseman should stand behind that person and refuse to enter unless that person is allowed to race. But, in Chicago and everywhere else for that matter horseman are only worried about their own welfare until something bad happens to them as in the case of Rick Dane.

     I know one thing for sure. If they did to me what they did to Joe without any proof that I did something wrong and accused me of something because some goof wrote bad letters about me I would be spending every dime I could get my hands on suing every last person I could if it took me 20 years to do so. No two bit ***hole *** would ever ruin my name and take away my right to race without paying the price one way or another.

     So, whoever wants to form a negatve opinion about Joe Dakuras go right ahead but I think the guy got the royal shaft from the Johnston's while they ruined any chance of Joe ever being able to obtain any big time owners or horses because they dragged his name through the mud. And for that reason alone if I were Joe I would be suing them for every dime they have. And let me point out to everyone that Joe is not my good friend and I hardy know Joe and have only talked to him a few times but until someone shows me hard core proof that Joe did something wrong I'm not buying the bullshit I read about him on this forum, nor do I think the Johnston's have the right to ruin the man's name.       
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icare
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« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2006, 02:45:53 PM »

The way I understand it joe's vet gave a horse the wrong horse a shot, easy done... vets work on horses alof the time with out the triner, yes kelly may have been in the barn But she may have been in the wash stall. when ruckers vet did this rucker got nothing but a bigger stable.
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swoodall
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« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2006, 03:03:14 PM »

Dan

I was only pointing out that the way you worded your comments on Joe,  it came across as Joe was a small time cheater that other horsemen didn't really need to worry about.  I wasn't commenting on Joe myself,  just your choice of words.
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2006, 05:07:47 PM »

Dan

I was only pointing out that the way you worded your comments on Joe,  it came across as Joe was a small time cheater that other horsemen didn't really need to worry about.  I wasn't commenting on Joe myself,  just your choice of words.

That's what everyone does, they turn my words around. I said nothing about Joe being any kind of small time cheater. What I said was it's not guys like Joe people need to worry about, it's the Ruckers and Anderson's who people should be looking to get thrown out for stealing other horseman's purse money. These guys are allowed to race no matter how many positives they get but yet they won't take Joe's entries because some total goof who is nothing but a crook himself writes a letter and gets Joe's entries denied.
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darth vader
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« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2006, 07:52:46 PM »

ANYONE CAUGHT CHEATING SHOULD BE  BANNED FOR LIFE  ONCE  A  CROOK ALWAYS A CROOK
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2006, 08:03:09 PM »

ANYONE CAUGHT CHEATING SHOULD BE  BANNED FOR LIFE  ONCE  A  CROOK ALWAYS A CROOK

Then I guess that leaves about 50 people left in the business. Dumbest statement I've ever head.
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darth vader
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« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2006, 08:09:51 PM »

WELL DAN LETS PUT IT THIS WAY SOMEONE YOU KNOW LETS  SAY   A FRIEND STEALS MONEY OUT OF YOUR HOUSE AND MAYBE  OR MAYBE YOUR IDENTITY AND COST YOU TONS OF MONEY AND HEADACHES  WOULD YOU WANT HIM BACK ON THE STREETS OR WOULD YOU LET HIM BE CLOSE TO  YOU AND BE YOUR FRIEND  AGAIN ..  I DON'T  THINK  SO !!!  NOT  SO DUMB  NOW ..  YET LETTING SOMEONE  CHEAT YOU AND THEN GIVE HIM OR  HER  ANOTHER  CHANCE TO DO IT  AGAIN NOW THATS PRETTY  DUMB
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2006, 08:44:49 PM »

WELL DAN LETS PUT IT THIS WAY SOMEONE YOU KNOW LETS  SAY   A FRIEND STEALS MONEY OUT OF YOUR HOUSE AND MAYBE  OR MAYBE YOUR IDENTITY AND COST YOU TONS OF MONEY AND HEADACHES  WOULD YOU WANT HIM BACK ON THE STREETS OR WOULD YOU LET HIM BE CLOSE TO  YOU AND BE YOUR FRIEND  AGAIN ..  I DON'T  THINK  SO !!!  NOT  SO DUMB  NOW ..  YET LETTING SOMEONE  CHEAT YOU AND THEN GIVE HIM OR  HER  ANOTHER  CHANCE TO DO IT  AGAIN NOW THATS PRETTY  DUMB

I don't understand what you're talking about and what you just said doesn't come close to your statement that all cheaters should be banned for life. I assume you meant the cheaters in harness racing.

   If your statement meant the cheaters in harness racing which I'm sure it did then what I said is that it would leave about 50 people left. If you consider any trainer who got a positive or many positives or any driver who stiffed a horse or a crooked owner as cheaters then there would not be many people left in racing. Now do you get my drift? You said all cheaters should be barred for life didn't you? Then let's start banning Rucker, Joe (the knife), and the rest who's names are up on the board in the racing office. Or should we get the printout from the USTA on all the violations in the country and start banning all the people who are cheaters? Don't talk to me about a friend robbing your house when that has nothing to do with what you said about cheaters in harness racing. According to you they should ban 90% of the horseman because they have cheated at one time or another. That was your words not mine.   
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Chitown Stan
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« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2006, 10:12:17 PM »

Dan, there wouldnt be only 50 people left in the business. Because once you ANNOUNCE a zero tolerance policy, and then actually make an example out of somebody, it will stop. THE IRB had a perfect chance to make an example out of Ken Rucker. They didn't.
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2006, 10:14:43 PM »

Dan, there wouldnt be only 50 people left in the business. Because once you ANNOUNCE a zero tolerance policy, and then actually make an example out of somebody, it will stop. THE IRB had a perfect chance to make an example out of Ken Rucker. They didn't.

Like how M99 stopped when the IRB made an example of some one.
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darth vader
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« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2006, 10:22:14 PM »

DAN THATS  WHY ITS  A  DYING  GAME BECAUSE THEY CAN'T OR RATHER WON'T CLEAN IT UP... YOU SAID IT  AND YOU KNOW IT IT'S  A  CROOKED  GAME 90%  OF THE  TIME IS  A  LITTLE HARSH MORE LIKE 60% BUT IT ONLY TAKES ONE BAD TASTE IN YOUR MOUTH NOT TO EAT THE SAME STUFF SO LETS START KICKING THE SCUM OUT AND MAYBE THINGS WILL  CHANGE BUT UNTIL THE GET TUFF ON THE  CHEATERS  THE  CHEATERS WILL STILL ALWAYS  CHEAT
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2006, 10:32:02 PM »

Like how M99 stopped when the IRB made an example of some one.

Spoken like a true management person. And who were you referring to when you made this statement? MY BROTHER, because he was the guy they made an example out of when they gave him life? They didn't make an example out of Dennis Bowen or they didn't go after the Redman with his 52 cloudy tests when they started testing for the shit.

   Hey management person, don't talk about my brother being an example because I'll have to tell you.... you are a no good ***, ***hole!
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2006, 10:37:18 PM »

Spoken like a true management person. And who were you referring to when you made this statement? MY BROTHER, because he was the guy they made an example out of when they gave him life? They didn't make an example out of Dennis Bowen or they didn't go after the Redman with his 52 cloudy tests when they started testing for the shit.

   Hey management person, don't talk about my brother being an example because I'll have to tell you.... you are a no good ***, ***hole!

No need to be upset. Just "telling it like it is". As some people here always say. Did IRB make an example of him or not? Yes. Did the M99 epidemic stop or not? Yes. What about "trainer responsibility"?
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2006, 11:02:10 PM »

No need to be upset. Just "telling it like it is". As some people here always say. Did IRB make an example of him or not? Yes. Did the M99 epidemic stop or not? Yes. What about "trainer responsibility"?

Management person, so you think it was ok for them to make an example out of a 21 year old who had his whole career ahead of him just so they could say they were doing something without having a full investigation on what really went on. Well, I'm so glad you feel that way. But, it's ok for the IRB to extend Rucker's stay so they can look more into his 6 positives. Well that's real fair isn't it?

    You have alot of *** nerve to talk about my brother when all these cheaters are running around these days getting away with murder. And let me clue you in about whether the M99 positives stopped. They didn't because there were SEVERAL other M99 positives after my brothers ordeal. Or don't you remember the trainers that went down a year and two after they made an example of my brother as you say they did.

    Hey management person why don't you talk about something current like how they should make an example out of Rucker because of all his numerous amounts of positives. What wrong don't want to talk about Rucker because he's still racing? You would rather talk about my brother and how you think it was just dandy for them to make an example out of him, right?

    Management person, you and the rest back there can kiss my *** ass.   
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #26 on: January 06, 2006, 11:14:47 PM »

Management person, so you think it was ok for them to make an example out of a 21 year old who had his whole career ahead of him just so they could say they were doing something without having a full investigation on what really went on.

I dont know. What I heard was the raid on his truck/car turned up the syringe with the juice that helped them develop the M99 test. Just what I heard.

No. I dont think its OK for Rucker to get off all the time. The subject was making an example of him like examples before. "Environmental contamination" sounds unbeleiveble for gout medication. Maybe it is because everyone at the track is so old all the $100 bills have the gout medicine on them from the old people handling them.
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2006, 11:41:54 PM »

I dont know. What I heard was the raid on his truck/car turned up the syringe with the juice that helped them develop the M99 test. Just what I heard.

No. I dont think its OK for Rucker to get off all the time. The subject was making an example of him like examples before. "Environmental contamination" sounds unbeleiveble for gout medication. Maybe it is because everyone at the track is so old all the $100 bills have the gout medicine on them from the old people handling them.

Well that's a new one. I guess you heard wrong. More racetrack talk that is far from the truth. Maybe it was the 52 cloudy tests that Farrington had in 1983 that they developed the test from.

    They developed the test by June 1984 then went after my brother so they could make an example out of someone and then went back 7 months and tested my brothers horses from Hawthorne because no doubt he had cloudy tests when Bowen was using M99 on his horses behind my brothers back.

    Like I said, that was real nice of them not to even have a full investigation and get to the bottom of who really put the shit in my brothers horses. No, they decided to ruin him for 12 years before he got his license back. Why didn't they go back and test Farrrington's 52 cloudy tests? We all know the answer to that, right? Mr. Hall Of Fame and the trainer of the horse that God loved " Rambling Willie " wasn't about to go down and give harness racing a bad rap. Better to go after a 21 year old kid and make an example out of him. They're all SCUM, and continue to be scum and I hope they all go to hell when there time comes. I love horses but the business itself SUCKS!!!! 
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« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2006, 11:53:24 PM »

Like how M99 stopped when the IRB made an example of some one.
...strong words from a troll who tried to admit they didn't attend the races until 1992.  How far back in the fake lie archives did you have to go to come up with this lie about events that took place years before you even went to the races as you say ?  Nice job "DICKIE THE MASTER TROLL. LOL   TC
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #29 on: January 07, 2006, 12:01:16 AM »

Well that's a new one. I guess you heard wrong. More racetrack talk that is far from the truth. Maybe it was the 52 cloudy tests that Farrington had in 1983 that they developed the test from.

    They developed the test by June 1984 then went after my brother so they could make an example out of someone and then went back 7 months and tested my brothers horses from Hawthorne because no doubt he had cloudy tests when Bowen was using M99 on his horses behind my brothers back.

What about "trainer responsibility". You were hammering on some one about that just today. Saying how the IRB should take him down on it. Who cares how M99 got in Scotts horses? "Trainer responsibility".
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Dan Nance
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« Reply #30 on: January 07, 2006, 12:12:43 AM »

What about "trainer responsibility". You were hammering on some one about that just today. Saying how the IRB should take him down on it. Who cares how M99 got in Scotts horses? "Trainer responsibility".

Where did I say that Scott should have gotten off scott free? I said they should have had a full investigation and then determined how much time he should serve for trainer responsibility. No, they were in a big hurry to make an example out of someone so they decided to hang him and give him life. Where does it say you get life for trainers responsibility? Dennis Bowen walked around the track owning horses for years while Scott had to fight and spend thousands to get his license back. Even RTP told everyone that Bowen had the horses juiced with M99 because RTP was once partners in our stable with Bowen. Bowen never *** with any of the horses he owned with Phil because he knew Phil would blow his head off if he got him in trouble. My brother is different then me because if they did to me what they did to him everyone of those cocksuckers would be 6 feet under by now.
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Richard Breth
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« Reply #31 on: January 07, 2006, 01:19:47 AM »

Modified 1/7 to claify news storys.


...strong words from a troll who tried to admit they didn't attend the races until 1992.  How far back in the fake lie archives did you have to go to come up with this lie about events that took place years before you even went to the races as you say ?  Nice job "DICKIE THE MASTER TROLL. LOL   TC

You beleive some one who first attended races in 1992 doesnt try to learn any thing about the past? Especially a subject discussed as often on the forum as this?

No wonder you are the king here. One eyed man.

FYI on the history of starting this forum. I think it was Joe Kristufek asked Janine to put up a harness forum as adjunct to the weekley show. I had nothing to do with it.

Some news for you. Read and enjoy.


Associated Press September 25, 1984

Trainer Charged with Using Illegal Stimulant on Horse

A suburban horse trainer was charged Tuesday with possessing an illegal elephant tranquilizer that state racing officials say was administered as a stimulant to a horse that won at Hawthorne Race Course in January.

Scott ***, 21, of suburban Woodridge, surrendered to a representative of the Cook County state's attorney's office at the Maybrook Courthouse in Maywood, said Jewel Klein, staff attorney for the Illinois Racing Board.

Ms. Klein said *** was charged with possession of the tranquilizer, etorphine, and of a hypodermic needle.

She said ***, who's been training horses for several years, was released after posting a $5,000 bond.

Traces of the drug were discovered in recent testing at the board's laboratory of a urine sample taken after the January race and then frozen, Ms. Klein said.

"Newly acquired, very sophisticated equipment allowed us to make the detection," she said.

It's believed to be the first time etorphine has been detected as a stimulant for a racehorse, Ms. Klein said.

She could not immeditely identify the racehorse or its winnings.

On Aug. 21, Ms. Klein said, agents from the Illinois Department of Law Enforcement alleged they had found a syringe and hypodermic needle in ***'s car, parked outside the horse barn at Sportsman's Park Race Track.

She said ***, who was subsequently barred from all Illinois race tracks, has requested a hearing before the racing board.

Investigators then began looking into the horses *** had dealings with, Ms. Klein said.


Chicago Tribune

June 18, 1985

ETORPHINE CASES STIR LAB FUROR

By Neil Milbert.

Gov. James Thompson's task force on horse racing believes the state's drug testing center should be affiliated with the University of Illinois. It currently is operated by the Illinois Racing Board, and the task force and a member of the board believe that the laboratory could be more efficient with a
university tie-in.

"It took nine months to find the fingerprint for etorphine," said board member Bob Ward, referring to a drug that has been found in 19 harness horses since the lab in Elgin began testing last summer. "If the laboratory had been an arm of the university instead of an arm of the racing board, maybe it would
only have taken four months."

The other board members, however, do not favor affiliating with the U. of I. "Our laboratory was the one that made the breakthroughs on etorphine, sublimaze, apomorphine and clenbuterol," member Ray Garrison pointed out.

Etorphine is the latest illegal substance to be abused by horsemen in the state. All 19 of the cases involved harness horses and took place between December, 1983, and April, 1985. There were 13 cases at Hawthorne, four at Maywood and two at Balmoral.

The drug, sometimes called "elephant juice," is a strong tranquilizer that, when used in minute amounts, acts as a powerful stimulant. The IRB has penalized six individuals for its use, and a ruling regarding another alleged offender is pending.

"I don't consider 19 cases since December, 1983, to be an etorphine epidemic," said Bill Bissett, IRB executive director.

"We announced last fall at the dates hearings that we had begun testing for the drug. These are the results."

Nine of the cases involved horses trained by Scott ***, and another was attributed to his brother, Dan. Scott received a lifetime suspension, and Dan was suspended for one year.

James Allen, a 70-year-old trainer, and Ron Thomas, a groom he employed, both were penalized for two cases at Maywood Park in March and April. Allen was suspended for one year and Thomas for five.
The other penalties were assessed to Roger Edwards, a lifetime suspension for four offenses, and Ed Marsh, a one-year suspension for one offense. A ruling is pending regarding Ron Quandt, charged with two offenses April 2 at Maywood.

All these cases were discovered through testing conducted by the IRB lab.

"Testing is such a vital function, and I don't know any reason to change a good track record," Garrison said. "As it exists now, the sole purpose of the forensic lab is to test for drugs and develop new tests to find new drugs."

The governor's task force report acknowledged that "the IRB Laboratory breakthroughs have been recognized, and procedures adopted by other equine drug testing laboratories. But there have been no published papers originating from the IRB Laboratory on research and development of new drug tests in the last decade.

"Experience at Cornell University, the University of Kentucky, Colorado State University and Ohio State University have shown that university affiliation greatly increases capabilities."

The majority of the board opposes changing the status quo, but Ward disagrees. "I regret the inference that a change would hurt," said Ward.

"There isn't a chemist on the board. I'm in the laundry business, Ralph Gonzalez runs an insurance company, Tom Garvey is an attorney. Tex Griffin is a commodities broker. Do you want me to tell you we can run that lab?

"Performance enhancement drugs are popping up in every sport. We see steroids in the Olympics and different concoctions being used in baseball and football. And right now somebody somewhere probably is injecting a horse with something nobody knows about.

"I have no quarrel with the skills of John McDonald (the IRB laboratory director). He is very talented, and there is no intention to do away with him. It just seems to me the University of Illinois College of Veterinary Medicine would help him, and it's time he asked for help."
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« Reply #32 on: January 07, 2006, 01:25:08 AM »

Where did I say that Scott should have gotten off scott free?

You didnt said that. You always said it was the owner fault. That Scott had nothing to do with it. That is the same as enviromental contamination isnt it.

A trainer either is or is not responsible. Wild storys like Dennis Bowen putting a crooked groom in the barn do not trump mild stoys like enviromental contamination.
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« Reply #33 on: January 07, 2006, 02:53:56 AM »

Getting back to the subject at hand, I also agree with the most of you guys, Dakuras should be participating in the game in some capacity. Joe’s one big problem is learning who he should of trusted. He was telling confidential information to people who are known racetrack snitches and management kiss Asses. They in turn ended up ratting him out to management. Joe did not do his homework on people he thought were his friends.  When you talk to snitches like Duncan Price-Ira Smolin-Scott Erhlich- and Dennis Brightwell, you are bound to get a knife stuck in your back when you are not looking.  Shame on Joe for being so stupid and trusting these guys. They ran back to Langley and the Johnstons faster than you could say ratfink. Hopefully Joe learned a valuable lesson on who to talk to and that you can never trust anyone nowadays, especially these guys. They have been management kiss ass back stabbers for years. Then again, Joe knew what these guys were all about. Brightwell would snitch on his own mother and Ira is even worse. Those are the kind of people that Joe associated with and ended up being his downfall. Live and learn I guess. Use better judgment next time Joe because if I were you, I would tell all of these management cronies to kiss your ass.

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« Reply #34 on: January 07, 2006, 04:05:47 AM »

Since when is "environmental contamination" a MILD story? And couldn't EVERYONE  use that as an excuse?
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« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2006, 04:18:41 AM »

You didnt said that. You always said it was the owner fault. That Scott had nothing to do with it. That is the same as enviromental contamination isnt it.

A trainer either is or is not responsible. Wild storys like Dennis Bowen putting a crooked groom in the barn do not trump mild stoys like enviromental contamination.

Wild story's you say? The IBI knew all about Dennis Bowen and his cousin that he planted in our barn to van horses to Steinmeyer and they knew about " Bomber " the groom that quit and disappeared after the Hawthorne meet. The IRB didn't do an investigation of Bowen, his cousin, Bomber, or Steinmeyer. Jewell Klein that *** IRB lawyer put out the statement you posted and only pointed the finger at Scott as the guilty person for idiots like you to read and believe. Whatever they say is fact right? Must be the way it happened right? Bullshit, the truth of the matter never came out. Only what they wanted everyone to believe and know. You and nobody else were around to know what went on and who was planted in our stable at Hawthorne that winter. So, believe what you want to believe I could care less and my brother probably feels the same way. But, for you to say we are making up wild stories about Bowen and his crew of criminals is something you know nothing about, Pal.

    You said it right when you said they made an example out of my brother. They sure did. Where's the article that said Scott was found innocent in court after they falsely charged him with position of a controlled substance? There is no article saying that because the IRB doesn't want anyone to know they wasted tax payers money trying to falsely charge my brother and they don't want to embarrass themselves that they lost in a court of law. They only want to put out statements that makes them look like they are doing something. And why didn't that *** Jewell Klein say that Dan *** didn't serve a 1 years suspension because the IRB made a deal with Dan to take 6 months because they knew he wasn't involved with any M99 positives only trainers responsibility. And why didn't she say that Dan *** never had an appeal hearing with the IRB in 4 years and raced until they made their deal with him in 1989. No, she says in that stupid artical that I was suspended for one year when I never was. All bullshit that they want people to believe.

   Like I said Dick Breath, they're all nothing but a bunch of scum cocksuckers that should all die a slow and painful death. They lie and cheat and try and make themselves look good to the public by making public statements about only what they want people to believe, not the truth. Dennis Bowen got his calling early in life because he was a no good piece of shit coke sniffing *** that ruined my brothers career and left him with a bad name. The good Lord above takes care of those who inflict pain on others and causes them grief. And then the almighty sends someone like me to a forum like this to finish the job by ripping every living sole that has it coming to them. That's right Dick Breath I believe in the power of the almighty Lord to take care of unfinished business through someone like me who knows how things really are and isn't afraid to " tell it like it is ".  Don't think for one minute the gestapo and the IRB likes what I say about them and the truth I post. I hope they read every word I post because my job won't be done until I let the world know just how evil and corrupt they all are.

   Now, keep posting your 20 year old articals Dick Breath because it opens the door for me to finish the job the Lord sent me to this forum to do.    
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« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2006, 11:00:23 AM »

Getting back to the subject at hand, I also agree with the most of you guys, Dakuras should be participating in the game in some capacity. Joe’s one big problem is learning who he should of trusted. He was telling confidential information to people who are known racetrack snitches and management kiss Asses. They in turn ended up ratting him out to management. Joe did not do his homework on people he thought were his friends.  When you talk to snitches like Duncan Price-Ira Smolin-Scott Erhlich- and Dennis Brightwell, you are bound to get a knife stuck in your back when you are not looking.  Shame on Joe for being so stupid and trusting these guys. They ran back to Langley and the Johnstons faster than you could say ratfink. Hopefully Joe learned a valuable lesson on who to talk to and that you can never trust anyone nowadays, especially these guys. They have been management kiss ass back stabbers for years. Then again, Joe knew what these guys were all about. Brightwell would snitch on his own mother and Ira is even worse. Those are the kind of people that Joe associated with and ended up being his downfall. Live and learn I guess. Use better judgment next time Joe because if I were you, I would tell all of these management cronies to kiss your ass.

Richard Breath & Interested Observer == Dennis Brightwell.

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« Reply #37 on: January 07, 2006, 11:13:21 AM »

Some news for you. Read and enjoy.


June 18, 1985

ETORPHINE CASES STIR LAB FUROR

By Neil Milbert.

Gov. James Thompson's task force on horse racing believes the state's drug testing center should be affiliated with the University of Illinois. It currently is operated by the Illinois Racing Board, and the task force and a member of the board believe that the laboratory could be more efficient with a
university tie-in.

"It took nine months to find the fingerprint for etorphine," said board member Bob Ward, referring to a drug that has been found in 19 harness horses since the lab in Elgin began testing last summer. "If the laboratory had been an arm of the university instead of an arm of the racing board, maybe it would
only have taken four months."

The other board members, however, do not favor affiliating with the U. of I. "Our laboratory was the one that made the breakthroughs on etorphine, sublimaze, apomorphine and clenbuterol," member Ray Garrison pointed out.

Etorphine is the latest illegal substance to be abused by horsemen in the state. All 19 of the cases involved harness horses and took place between December, 1983, and April, 1985. There were 13 cases at Hawthorne, four at Maywood and two at Balmoral.

The drug, sometimes called "elephant juice," is a strong tranquilizer that, when used in minute amounts, acts as a powerful stimulant. The IRB has penalized six individuals for its use, and a ruling regarding another alleged offender is pending.

"I don't consider 19 cases since December, 1983, to be an etorphine epidemic," said Bill Bissett, IRB executive director.

"We announced last fall at the dates hearings that we had begun testing for the drug. These are the results."

Nine of the cases involved horses trained by Scott ***, and another was attributed to his brother, Dan. Scott received a lifetime suspension, and Dan was suspended for one year.

James Allen, a 70-year-old trainer, and Ron Thomas, a groom he employed, both were penalized for two cases at Maywood Park in March and April. Allen was suspended for one year and Thomas for five.
The other penalties were assessed to Roger Edwards, a lifetime suspension for four offenses, and Ed Marsh, a one-year suspension for one offense. A ruling is pending regarding Ron Quandt, charged with two offenses April 2 at Maywood.

All these cases were discovered through testing conducted by the IRB lab.


Associated Press September 25, 1984

Trainer Charged with Using Illegal Stimulant on Horse

A suburban horse trainer was charged Tuesday with possessing an illegal elephant tranquilizer that state racing officials say was administered as a stimulant to a horse that won at Hawthorne Race Course in January.

Scott ***, 21, of suburban Woodridge, surrendered to a representative of the Cook County state's attorney's office at the Maybrook Courthouse in Maywood, said Jewel Klein, staff attorney for the Illinois Racing Board.

Ms. Klein said *** was charged with possession of the tranquilizer, etorphine, and of a hypodermic needle.

She said ***, who's been training horses for several years, was released after posting a $5,000 bond.

Traces of the drug were discovered in recent testing at the board's laboratory of a urine sample taken after the January race and then frozen, Ms. Klein said.

"Newly acquired, very sophisticated equipment allowed us to make the detection," she said.

It's believed to be the first time etorphine has been detected as a stimulant for a racehorse, Ms. Klein said.

She could not immeditely identify the racehorse or its winnings.

On Aug. 21, Ms. Klein said, agents from the Illinois Department of Law Enforcement alleged they had found a syringe and hypodermic needle in ***'s car, parked outside the horse barn at Sportsman's Park Race Track.

She said ***, who was subsequently barred from all Illinois race tracks, has requested a hearing before the racing board.

Investigators then began looking into the horses *** had dealings with, Ms. Klein said.

I am not making any statement about this information one way or the other.  Rather, I have a question.

Why is Richard Breth NOT required to post a source for this information?

If any other forum member posts information from an article, they are required to post the internet link to it.  I realize the dates of publication are well before information was able to be viewed online.  Since this is likely the case here, it should be cited in the same format as a footnote in a written paper.  Otherwise, the author may be guilty of altering information or something more severe, like plagiarism.  Providing a source for the information would make it possible for interested parties to pull the originals from various archives, if desired.
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« Reply #38 on: January 07, 2006, 11:49:40 AM »

Elsie,

If you haven't noticed, this forum isn't exactly known for its accuracy.
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« Reply #39 on: January 07, 2006, 12:00:05 PM »

First article. Chicago Tribune, June 18, 1985.

Second article. AP news feed, Sports, September 25, 1984.

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« Reply #40 on: January 07, 2006, 12:24:01 PM »

Scott Erlich = snitch?
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« Reply #41 on: January 07, 2006, 12:47:34 PM »

I am not making any statement about this information one way or the other.  Rather, I have a question.

Why is Richard Breth NOT required to post a source for this information?

If any other forum member posts information from an article, they are required to post the internet link to it.  I realize the dates of publication are well before information was able to be viewed online.  Since this is likely the case here, it should be cited in the same format as a footnote in a written paper.  Otherwise, the author may be guilty of altering information or something more severe, like plagiarism.  Providing a source for the information would make it possible for interested parties to pull the originals from various archives, if desired.

Isn't it obvious that Dick Breath is somehow tied in with management. If not how can he obtain what he posted on a Friday night at around 11PM?

    Let this management person post anything he or she has the desire to post because like I stated above the scumbags only put out the information they want the public to believe. The real truth will be told by someone like me who was there and knows what the truth really is.

    Did you notice that the *** Jewell Klein said they develped a test for M99 in June of 1984? Then they put there little scheme together and decided to come after my brother 2 months later in August. Then they go back to Hawthorne 8 months earlier and test 12 horses for M99 because they had cloudly tests. They don't bother to test the 52 cloudy tests that Farrington had from the summer of 1983 because he is the almighty " Hall Of Famer " who was well known for racing the " Horse God Loved " Rambling Willie. Can't bring down someone like him and slap a bad name on harness racing so go after a 21 year old kid who is just starting to make a name for himself in the business. Don't bother to have a full investigation when the stewards and the IBI learn an owner by the name of Dennis Bowen and his friend Dr. Paul Steinmeyer a vet who was ruled off the track a year earlier when they found illegal drugs in his truck on the baskside of Maywood Park. No, that would be too much trouble to look into what really was going on when Bowen planted his cousin and a goom that went by the name " Bomber " in the stable at Hawthorne that winter. The IRB and their *** lawyer Jewell Klein wanted to make an example out of someone so rather too investigate just say Scott *** juiced up 12 horses at Hawthorne with M99 and charge him with a felony of a controlled substance. Waste the tax payers money going to court only too have the judge scold the IRB and throw the case right out the door. I was there I witnessed what the judge said. Oh, let me not forget to mention that Dr. Paul Steinmeyer was also Farrington's vet during the summer of 1983. I learned M99 cost about $8000 to purchase and could only be bought by a licensed vet, not some 21 year old trainer that didn't even have $8000 cash in his pocket to purchase a controlled substance. Let a crooked owner Dennis Bowen go on owning horses and send a young trainer away for 12 years, that's the IRB at work at their finest. Tell me? If Scott *** was guilty why didn't the life suspension hold up? Why did the IRB give him his license back 12 years later after my brother filed a $250,000 law suit against the IRB that dragged out in court for years.  

   That article that Dick breath posted was only released to make the IRB look good to the public and make everyone think they were doing such a great job. Yeah, they're doing such a fine job today letting cheaters with numerous positives and 6 month suspensions walk around and keep racing while they tell the public they are extending his stay so they can investigate how gout got into his horses. Give me a *** break already with this bullshit. Those ***hole at the IRB and their lawyer don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. Isn't that right Rick Dane?  
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« Reply #42 on: January 07, 2006, 12:55:34 PM »

    Great post Dan, Can you tell us what happened in Scott's lawsuit against the IRB. Good or bad please let us know, I understand its hard to sue the IRB and get anything but I still would like to know.
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« Reply #43 on: January 07, 2006, 01:02:23 PM »

    Great post Dan, Can you tell us what happened in Scott's lawsuit against the IRB. Good or bad please let us know, I understand its hard to sue the IRB and get anything but I still would like to know.

Better yet. Dan post the docket number of Scotts case. So we can read the transcipt ourselfs. free of any of your interpetation.
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« Reply #44 on: January 07, 2006, 01:04:37 PM »

Isn't it obvious that Dick Breath is somehow tied in with management. If not how can he obtain what he posted on a Friday night at around 11PM?

It was all ready on my computer from some time before. Another theory down.
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« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2006, 01:05:56 PM »

First article. Chicago Tribune, June 18, 1985.

Second article. AP news feed, Sports, September 25, 1984.

I am glad you do have the sources to list.  Page numbers would be nice, but that is likely asking too much.

Now, please go back and place this information in the original post, just like anyone else would be expected to do.

Thank you!
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« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2006, 01:10:26 PM »

    Great post Dan, Can you tell us what happened in Scott's lawsuit against the IRB. Good or bad please let us know, I understand its hard to sue the IRB and get anything but I still would like to know.

After the suit dragged out in court for years the IRB offered to give Scott his license back if he dropped his lawsuit. That's when Scott got his license back in Feb. of 1996 at Hawthorne. Scott had a guy by the name of Riccolo claim the horse " Nutty Irishman " at Hawthorne. In his first start for Scott after his 12 year abstinence with Morgan driving the horse won by 3 and paid something like $18 I beieve. I went down to the winners circle and shook my brothers hand and said to him " welcome back ". It was a great moment for him I'm sure after waiting 12 years.
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« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2006, 01:17:38 PM »

Better yet. Dan post the docket number of Scotts case. So we can read the transcipt ourselfs. free of any of your interpetation.

The docket number from what? The felony charge of a controlled substance that was dismissed by the judge after he ripped into the IRB lawyer and the IBI for waisting the courts time? Man that was a classic to watch the judge rip the ass off the IRB and IBI for waisting the tax payers money, you should have been there.

    Or, the docket number from the lawsuit filed?
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« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2006, 01:30:34 PM »

After the suit dragged out in court for years the IRB offered to give Scott his license back if he dropped his lawsuit. That's when Scott got his license back in Feb. of 1996 at Hawthorne. Scott had a guy by the name of Riccolo claim the horse " Nutty Irishman " at Hawthorne. In his first start for Scott after his 12 year abstinence with Morgan driving the horse won by 3 and paid something like $18 I beieve. I went down to the winners circle and shook my brothers hand and said to him " welcome back ". It was a great moment for him I'm sure after waiting 12 years.

Dan I know you and your brother are settled down in Las Vegas but wouldn't it be nice to come in in the summer months to train a couple? Once your a trainer its in your blood for life its not easy to remove I know you'll always miss it somewhat. Many of these guy's today are not real trainers today they just as well list the vet as the trainer. The bills that some of these owners get these days are unbelievible if I was an owner I surely would not show freinds my vet bills today because I would be embarrased. You had more real "TRAINERS" back in the 1970's and 1980's. I think JOE BLOW could get a trainers license these day's, get a top vet and inject, inject and inject and I forgot pre-race week after week and bat .400 until they break them down, then they just find a new horse and do it over and over again.
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« Reply #49 on: January 07, 2006, 01:31:22 PM »

The docket number from what? The felony charge of a controlled substance that was dismissed by the judge after he ripped into the IRB lawyer and the IBI for waisting the courts time? Man that was a classic to watch the judge rip the ass off the IRB and IBI for waisting the tax payers money, you should have been there.

    Or, the docket number from the lawsuit filed?

Both would be OK. If there are more those also.
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« Reply #50 on: January 07, 2006, 01:47:44 PM »

Did you notice that the *** Jewell Klein said they develped a test for M99 in June of 1984? Then they put there little scheme together and decided to come after my brother 2 months later in August. Then they go back to Hawthorne 8 months earlier and test 12 horses for M99 because they had cloudly tests.


It didnt say that.

The first article was June 1985. Mostly about the politics of the test lab. I left off some of that politics but will add it back. It talks about events of 1984 and December 1983. Says it took them 9 months to find the test. December 1983 to September 1984 9 months.

Second article is from mid September 1984. Says they raided Scotts car August 1984. They charged Scott in September 1984 on the basis of frozen samples. Fits the timeline of what I heard about how the test got developed. Does not say it specificaly. should be pointed out.

I will go back to re arrange in order and add date and source to Trib article. Some readers having trouble.
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« Reply #51 on: January 07, 2006, 02:01:06 PM »

Both would be OK. If there are more those also.

If you want them from the felony charge then go look them up because I don't have the time. I would love for the transcripts to be posted on this forum so that everyone could get a real laugh at what the judge said to the IRB and the IBI before he dismissed the case. I was in the court room.

    As far as Scott's lawsuit that's up to him if he wants his personal business posted on this forum. Let him addresss that if he ever returns to this forum. 
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