How crooked can they be: Not a fable

[Chartwell]

Once upon a time (Today) there was an owner who wanted to claim a horse at Arlington Park. He dropped the claim in timely and filed out the claim card correctly. He had the card date stamped and placed it in the claim box in a timely fashion. After the race in which the horse he claimed from one of the bigger trainers (No not Frank) was run this owner was informed that his claim had been voided.

Perplexed the owner asked why and was told that the back of the envelope had been marked to identify it. The owner confused to say the least asked to see the envelope and was shown the envelope which had a small pinpoint mark on the edge apparently from having it stuck in the same pocket with his pen or perhaps this "identifing mark" might have been put on the envelope when it was dropped in the claim box or possibly after the envelope was pulled out?  Make no mistake this was not a fold, a red X or a line. It wouldn't even qualify as a stratch. However it appears that CSI must work for the Illinois Racing Board. In any event after protesting the owner was instructed to call the stewards if he wished to file a complaint.

Down came the steward. He looked at the envelope and with the help of the clerk pointing to the "identifing mark" he indicated that it was clearly marked. So much for our legal system. For the record no other claims were dropped on this horse. The horse in question ran second.

This owner feels like he took a risk that the horse could have broken down during the race, bowed a tendon and never raced again. What the owner got was SCREWED by the Illinois Racing Board and the steward. Seems like over 25% of claims have been voided for one reason or another. Wonder how many of those are from the BIG owners. I'll bet Wayne, Larry and Mike haven't had any of their claims voided. Their claim envelopes must be teflon coated before they are placed oh so gingerly in the claim box.  Wonder why we have a problem in Illinois. I go to the track to have fun. Today I got CHEATED.

Sincerely,

Steve H. Lewis
Looking to race in Indiana and Kentucky very soon!

 

[Exbourne]

Steve I Feel ya.

I have a story That would make this whole forum cringe on a stewards ruling Involving me.
Just a piece of advise.Bringing this here will get you no future favors Or do you no good.
Leave your name out because they are arrogant and it might come back to haunt you again in the future.
I understand your anger and frustration but just giving you friendly advice.

[Chartwell]

I appreciate your advice but right is right. I have been racing horses in Illinois for more than 15 years and this is the single most crooked act I have ever scene. I thought that the good old boys network was confined to in New Orleans. Boy was I wrong. Its one things to get screwed but please KISS me first.

My parents taught me right from wrong. Perhaps someone should offer the Illinois racing officials a short course. Maybe instead of the post parade Bonnie should play three blind mice!

[dogs up]

Chartwell

This is just another example of what is wrong with this sport. I know Liane Davis is your trainer, and it's too bad she cannot break from the script and do an over the air commentary about this while doing her daily race previews.

As long as you have gone this far, you might as well file a formal complaint with the racing board. Not that those fools will overrule the stewards, but at this point, you've already made your anger known so you might as well go all the way. The other ting you can do is wait for about 11 months, see what happens with the horse, and perhaps be able to sue the IRB for income lost by this decision(depending on what the horse wins)

[Chartwell]

Racing is my hobby. Hobbies are supposed to be fun. When a hobby isn't fun anymore  it is time to find another hobby. Horse racing in Illinois could and should be great. At one time it was special. Going to Arlington Park in the 60's and 70's was an awesome experience. Now the purses are substandard,  the management of the sport and our elected officials have reached a level where we cannot compete with the like of West Virginia. Enough said.

Unfortunately its the trainers who are honest, the vets who are honest, the grooms who are honest, the blacksmiths and the farm owners who will all ultimately pay the price for our legislatures actions.

For me its not my livelihood. But for others it is at least today if not tomorrow!@

[pamwaggy]

Very interesting thread. 

[Exbourne]

Chart,

Look I have many issues on being screwed as I stated before.Not just the one stewards ruling.
Ive been screwed by the ITBOF.Not going to go public with it cause it does not do any one any good and wont change what happened.
Just pure ignorance and Lack of any responsibility By the above mentioned.
The people That Have NOT Screwed me are my Trainer who I have a wonderful respect for and my partners.
Going on here again will solve nothing..Nothing will come of you being screwed. 
Now someone has mentioned your trainer and that puts an undue pressure on her.
You have to decide if you want to be in the game anymore.
I quit for two weeks..Im a fool an and idiot for coming back..Do your homework find another one
Have witnesses Before/during and after you drop your next claim slip and stick it up there a$$es.End this thread.
You probably have 10 plus years on me in this game.
Turn your fire into something else and stick it in there behinds.

[Chartwell]

For public record. My trainer had zero to do with this and was not involved in this at all. In fact I alone picked the horse to claim. Filled out the claim card and deposited it into the claim box. I cannot in good faith stick my head in the sand and pretend that everything is rosie.

This system in crooked and needs to be fixed. I would love it if someone on the racing board tried to fix this so everyone could enjoy this sport as it should be. If they are stupid enough to try to retaliate then there is always the court system. Far smaller crooks are spending time in jail. Perhaps they should resign and run for Governor of Illinois!

[Moon]

You would think they could tell you it was invalid when they stamped it??

I don't know how this works, but it seems like they could let you know BEFORE they made the pick, so that you could get a chance to correct the mistake.

[CLOCKERTERRY]

No good can come of publicly running down the stews, or appealing to the IRB. The stews don't change their rulings, the IRB never overturns the stews, and the stews (and everyone else) will just make your life more miserable. Yours and your trainer's. If there's a rule against marks there's a rule against marks. It's probably in the IRB rulebook. I don't have time this morning; maybe Janine could find it. I don't know WHY there is a rule against marks, as the envelopes themselves aren't involved in the shakes, are they? Maybe it is so no one can yank a claim slip out of the box for a friend when a horse breaks down in a race. Something.

Next time take a digital photo of the of the back of your envelope, with a witness, before you turn it in. Then they will have to find a different excuse to void your claim.

[CLOCKERTERRY]

P.S. Was your claim slip envelope opened? If it was marked, they shouldn't have even opened it to see what horse it was for.

[Chartwell]

Good question. I don't know. Probably to late to find out now.

[nwaryas]

Steve, This was an interesting post. least you don't have Hutch shoeing your horse. He is known to be one of the worst in the backstretch.

[APtommy]

I don't blame you a bit for venting here on a public forum.  Might not help you at all, but might at least help the next guy see it coming.

Being cheated is my biggest pet peeve.  Except like George Carlin said, " I don't have pet peeves, I have psychotic F%%^ ing hatreds."

[Jim C]

I would think the rule about marking envelopes comes from no one being able to ID any specific claim. The envelopes are not opened until AFTER the horse has been officially claimed especially after a shake in which all the envelopes are laid out on the counter and marked 1 through how many claims there may be on a horse. I could see if anyone were involved in a shake for a horse and one envelope was marked in any way on the outside it could cause a problem. Having said that if there was no shake involved I see no reason why it would matter at all except that someone is trying to go by the book word for word. If they are I would like to see some of the many safety claims that go thru that box between some certain owners/trainers get caught and stopped!

I have had a claim voided because I didn't sign the slip the exact way I signed my license. It sucks but the rules are the rules. Stupid as some may seem.

[warden]

Pure BS! I'd raced and claimed horses amd lost them for over 20 years and I never heard of such BS rule , a pinprick and when there is not another claimslip also in for that horse. If that is the rule there fine, but only if there is going to be a shake.

This looks like collusion between the trainer or owner of the large outfit and some theiving paddock judge or whoever opens the envelopes.

[RunSuckerRun]

Jim C writes:

The envelopes are not opened until AFTER the horse has been officially claimed especially after a shake in which all the envelopes are laid out on the counter and marked 1 through how many claims there may be on a horse.

No, they are all opened prior the race going off to ensure there is money in the account for the claim and the cards are correct.

-RSR

[Jim C]

Sucker...you are correct!! My mistake big time. Thought about it after I posted and realized how the hell would they even know which horse was being claimed if they didn't open the envelope??!! DUH...

Not sure what the rule is for now.....need to ask a few people see what the origin of this rule is.

[David]

Don't know in particular about horse racing claim envelopes, but I would guess the no mark on the envelope rule is to prevent people from grabbing the envelope back if they want out, like was mentioned above. I do know in construction bids, they have the same no mark policy and that is the reasoning.

[Chartwell]

Once the envelope is put in the box there is no way to get it back. It is date stamped so quite frankly just by the date stamp time you could identify an envelope if you wanted to. The bottom line is I got CHEATED. Sorry for yelling Terry but the frustration refuses to subside!

[Earl Sande]

It says in the Illinois rulebook that "claims shall be signed and sealed in an envelope having no identification mark except:  1/ the name of the track  2/ the number of the race from which the claim is being made  3/ the stamp of a timing device
So I guess technically the judges may be right.
BUT, what difference does it make if there are markings on the envelope? Don't they still number the envelopes and pull out pills when there is a shake? How could any marks effect the fairness of the shake? I don't get it.

[Chartwell]

Marking the envelope shouldn't effect the shake. In this case there was not shake. I had the only claim in for the horse. Finally the envelope was not marked. It had a mark less than the size of a pinhead that could have come from anywhere. It might have come from when I put it in my pocket to watch the horse being lead over, it might have been there when I grabbed the envelope off the desk or it might have been put there by someone else. Next time someone claims I suggest they bring a CSI investigator to examine the envelope before they drop the claim. For all I know the mark could have been made if and when the envelope was opened or placed on a desk.

Still fuming!

[ggenie]

I was voided once for not being sealed properly

[Trackman]

I do recall an incident at Beulah Park several years ago where an official was fired for marking entry cards so he could feel the marking and have a better chance of picking the horse to get a good post position. The official and a trainer were in cahoots. I suppose the same thing could happen with a claim.

[whiteathame]

.... Now the purses are substandard,  the management of the sport and our elected officials have reached a level where we cannot compete with the like of West Virginia. Enough said....

Maryland racing can't compete with West Virginia's either.  I'm a small Maryland owner.  I live 15 minutes from Laurel, 15 minutes from my trainer's horse farm in Gambrills but my ponies are vanned to Charles Town, WV (an 1:50 drive) where the slot-supported purses make  Maryland's look anemic. 

Who plays their slots?  Not a scientific study but there are more Maryland vehicles in the CT parking areas than those from West Virginia and Virginia combined.   It takes slots to feed the constant five- and six-figure purses demanded by allowance and stakes-grade horse owners.   Alternatives are race cards that look more like Finger Lakes or Indiana Downs than Gulfstream or Belmont and tracks that are barely maintained.  I wonder how much longer we'll keep the Preakness at run-down Pimlico.

[Earl Sande]

Are the purses at CT that much better than those at Pim & Lrl? I thought they were about the same. By the way, went to Laurel in the winter of 2006 and had a great time. Fantastic old plant in a neat setting (and in typical Magna fashion, grouchy employees and the gift shop was closed).
And if you think FL and Ind are bad, things are worse out here at slotless FP!

[Stat Man Steve]

CT & PHA purses now slightly larger than LRL & PIM.  Thought I saw where they'd overpaid purses in MD, so it might go down a bit when they return to MD after the CNL meet.  In any event, I currently consider these tracks lateral moves.  JMHO. 

[BeauNarro]

As I previously stated - Philly Park is increasing the daily purses by about 25 to 30% effective with the July condition book.

[CLOCKERTERRY]

While their on track wagering is down close to 20%.

Total disconnect between public interest in horse racing and purses paid = house of cards. 

[BeauNarro]

You're correct there Terry. As I said in some other thread, their management tried to reneg on the seperate "casino" building too. The patrons and horsemen at this time are stuffed on "only" the fifth floor. That's why I think their handle is so far down.

[CLOCKERTERRY]

There was an article just today that said they dropped their petition to make the current building the permanent casino. So, three years from now, there should be a separate casino. By then the 4 horse racing patrons left will rattle around pretty good inside those 5 floors of racetrack that you know damn well they aren't going to rebuild as nice as it was before they ripped it up for slots.

[Moon]

While their on track wagering is down close to 20%.

Total disconnect between public interest in horse racing and purses paid = house of cards. 

At this point, aren't we resigned to the fact that horse racing is diluted and perhaps dwindling? Maybe the only way the few of us left will get to see horse racing in our golden years is if it is propped up by slots.

[NIATROSS]

There is simply too much live racing without the horse population to support it.There will be good live racing that is still around that is not supported by slots(KY,NY AND CA).The tracks that are failing failed to supply a good product when given the opportunity.Businesses will always fail when you do not provide the consumer with a good product(CHRYSLER,NHL,K-MART,SPORTSMAN'S PARK AFTER THE SWITCH TO 7/8 TRACK).

There is more money now being wagered than ever before but so much is lost by being bet offshore or thru companies which do not provide any live racing.It will take some time to undo the mess the tracks created with simulcasting but in the long run they will be more profitable.

[whiteathame]

Maryland might be getting slots!  The former (Republican) governor, Bob Ehrlich, wanted slots too but Mike Busch (Democrat) House Speaker killed his attempt.  Maybe (Democrat) O'Malley will succeed.   This is as close as we;ve come, wish you luck too.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/politics/bal-te.md.slots14jun14,0,6259609.story?coll=bal-home-headlines


Extract from Baltimore Sun-
O'Malley sees slots as savior of racing
Governor in talks with Miller, Busch on compromise bill
By Andrew A. Green
Sun reporter
Originally published June 14, 2007
A day after Maryland's horse tracks announced severe budget cuts and reduced purses, Gov. Martin O'Malley said he believes slot machines at tracks are necessary to save the state's racing industry and the jobs that depend on it.

"The racing industry and the jobs and the open space that is used by the racing industry - all these things are threatened by their inability to compete with tracks in states around us who are able to offer slots," O'Malley said during a news conference. "We can't expect them to thrive, or even survive, ... if we handicap them and don't allow them the tools that the tracks in all the other states are using."