Chicago Barn to Wire
Home | News | Bloggers | Forums | Resources | Links | Marketplace | Gallery | Contact Us | Search


November 23, 2014, 12:58:50 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: If you don't remember your password, email me.

New  registration procedures -- Some ISPs have been bouncing the verification emails.  Please email me to be activated or if you have any problems.  Click Contact Us above.
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: 1 [2] 3   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Jose C. Ferrer still riding  (Read 5733 times)
CLOCKERTERRY
Guest

« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2006, 03:12:24 PM »

Sway Back what exactly did you ask them at Calder?

Sometimes tracks don't honor other tracks' exclusions of undesirable characters, but almost always if there is a state racing board suspension it's honored in every other racing state. Every state that belongs to ARCI is supposed to honor every other state. Florida and Illinois are both members. It's how Steve Asmussen gets busted for a positive in Louisiana, and then ends up not being able to train anywhere in the U.S. When Neil Drysdale finally took his brutal one week suspension for the Hawthorne Derby drug incident, he was also suspended in California. It's why, when Billy Patin got busted for a buzzer in Arkansas, he was out of racing everywhere (for awhile - still don't understand why one state's "lifetime suspension" doesn't last a lifetime in other states.) That's how it is supposed to work. It's very surprising to read what you claim someone at Calder said.
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2006, 03:25:57 PM »

Terry I simply called the racing office and asked the gentleman that if Illinois issued a 5 day riding suspension to a jockey would Florida have to honor it. He said no and that they dont even honor Illinois fingerprint cards ( he was laughing when he said that). I posted the number for others to call. I would love you to call and ask the same question. I was merely looking for the true answer and not a matter of who's right or wrong but I'm amazed at the number of people like jrstark, Thomas Graham, nwaryas etc. that act like they know what they are talking about and it amazes me how little they know. At least I am seeking the truth. I do know that Pat Day was suspended in Louisiana and Kentucky did not honor that suspension. For Ferrer if he plans on riding in Illinois he better abide by their suspension or they can deny him a license in the future.
Report to moderator   Logged
CLOCKERTERRY
Guest

« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2006, 03:30:35 PM »

Terry I simply called the racing office and asked the gentleman that if Illinois issued a 5 day riding suspension to a jockey would Florida have to honor it. He said no and that they dont even honor Illinois fingerprint cards ( he was laughing when he said that). I posted the number for others to call. I would love you to call and ask the same question. I was merely looking for the true answer and not a matter of who's right or wrong but I'm amazed at the number of people like jrstark, Thomas Graham, nwaryas etc. that act like they know what they are talking about and it amazes me how little they know. At least I am seeking the truth. I do know that Pat Day was suspended in Louisiana and Kentucky did not honor that suspension. For Ferrer if he plans on riding in Illinois he better abide by their suspension or they can deny him a license in the future.

What is the name of the man you talked to?
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2006, 03:32:47 PM »

What is the name of the man you talked to?

Did not get his name. Do you need the phone number again?
Report to moderator   Logged
CLOCKERTERRY
Guest

« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2006, 03:38:51 PM »

Did not get his name. Do you need the phone number again?

No, you didn't erase it.

You should always get a person's name on a call like that.
Report to moderator   Logged
mel4600
Guest

« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2006, 03:39:14 PM »

I believe that all tracks will honor the suspensions wether they have to or not otherwise you will have pandemonium with illegal activity going unpunished. Each state probably has their own rules and regulations and if they do not honor suspensions involving actions that alter the results of a given race the other states will reciprocate and the sport will be totally ruined.
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2006, 03:47:08 PM »

No, you didn't erase it.

You should always get a person's name on a call like that.
Didn't get his name since it is one persons opinion. I am looking for legal written verification and could not find anything in the Illinois rules and regulations as of yet.
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2006, 03:49:47 PM »

I believe that all tracks will honor the suspensions wether they have to or not otherwise you will have pandemonium with illegal activity going unpunished. Each state probably has their own rules and regulations and if they do not honor suspensions involving actions that alter the results of a given race the other states will reciprocate and the sport will be totally ruined.

The question is can Illinois make Florida uphold the suspension yes or no? What they choose to do is another story.
Report to moderator   Logged
CLOCKERTERRY
Guest

« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2006, 04:28:16 PM »

The question is can Illinois make Florida uphold the suspension yes or no? What they choose to do is another story.

It isn't a matter of Illinois forcing Florida or any state. It's a voluntary agreement they make as members of ARCI.

I'm going to write an email to that body, and see what answer I get, if any.   
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2006, 04:52:54 PM »

It isn't a matter of Illinois forcing Florida or any state. It's a voluntary agreement they make as members of ARCI.

I'm going to write an email to that body, and see what answer I get, if any.   

Mandatory and voluntary are two different things. Anyway good idea about the email and let us know.
Report to moderator   Logged
CLOCKERTERRY
Guest

« Reply #35 on: December 11, 2006, 05:41:36 PM »

Mandatory and voluntary are two different things.

Yes they are. Did someone say it was mandatory?

I think it's voluntary to be part of ARCI, but once you are, it's mandatory that you observe the reciprocity. That's a guess, though.
Report to moderator   Logged
Thomas Graham
Guest

« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2006, 06:29:41 PM »

Sway,

I called that number and spoke to the racing secretary - Mike Anifatis - he said suspensions are honored but not necessarily exclusions.  Once the suspension is upheld by the IRB (and any court stays that Ferrer seeks expire), then he'll have to serve the days even if he rides in Florida.

An exclusion, where the track (not the stewards or the regulatory body) simpy toss someone out (like Churchill did to Torres) is up to each individual track whether or not to uphold.

As far as fingerprints, you are right Florida doesn[t accept an Illinois finger print card.

TJG

P.S.  Asmussen can't train in Fla until his Louisiana suspension is over.

P.P.S.  I do know what I am talking about.  I've been around the track all my life, have owned horses and have had relatives and friends that work there, so don't go around saying I don't know what I am talking about when you don't even know who I am --- and at least I use my name and don't hide behind a screen name.
Report to moderator   Logged
nwaryas
Guest

« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2006, 06:47:09 PM »

Sway, go stick your head in the toliet and flush it. You really lost a battle. Just like Anna.
Report to moderator   Logged
big wally
Guest

« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2006, 06:58:19 PM »

Sway, go stick your head in the toliet and flush it. You really lost a battle. Just like Anna.

Before or After being used?
Report to moderator   Logged
Chartwell
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 310




Ignore
« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2006, 07:57:58 PM »

Whole discussion seems to be alot about a little. For the record I would be happy to have Jose ride my horses anytime. While I viewed the ride in question I have always believed Jose at least tries when he has the horse which is more than I can say about almost half the jockey colony as Hawthorne. Then there is the ability factor. The man can ride, rate and get the best out of a horse. Finally the track condition is lousy and if I where a jockey I would certainly rather ride in Florida apposed to beautiful Chicago in December.
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2006, 07:59:51 AM »

Sway, go stick your head in the toliet and flush it. You really lost a battle. Just like Anna.

You seem to be in LOVE with Anna. I still dont believe your friend Thomas Graham, I'll call the same person and verify it myself. He also stated the issue was being "adjudicated" in Circuit Court!!

P.S. Your still a ***!!
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2006, 08:02:23 AM »

It's a moot point at the moment as  Ferrer is not suspended at the moment since he has a stay from the Circuit Court.  Once his case is adjudicated and the days re-issued, they'll be honored throught the US

Mr. Graham do you remember this quote? May I ask why you said this bullshit?
Report to moderator   Logged
Thomas Graham
Guest

« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2006, 10:42:23 AM »

I recall saying that and I stand by it.  Suspensions (not exclusions) are honored at tracks across the nation by reciprocal agreement as ClockerTerry said in his comments.  When jocks here get five days (or three days or whatever) they cannot go elsewhere to ride except in designated races (you can see that phrase in nearly every ruling ruling issued by the Stews - and they are hanging up in the racing office at Hawthorne if you'd like to see them).  I asked Eddie Arroyo one day what a desgignated race was and in laymans terms he said its basically any stakes race on a track's published stakes schedule (I.e. not an overnight stakes race).

I'll further go on to discuss when a license is denied as opposed to a suspension.  When P-Val's license was denied when he was first coming back from one of his drug-related suspensions a couple of years back (in other words, he served the 6 months or the year or whatever) and California denied him a license, he could have gone elsewhere and applied for a license, which may or may not have been approved depending on the jurisdiction.

Look Sway, I know you are looking for definitve answers in writing and I don't have those, but like you, I've asked a lot of questions over the years as an owner and fan of the game. 

As I said in a past post, one of my relatives is involved with the sport but he doesn't post here because everytime he does, people assume he is speaking for his employers, and he has decided not to risk his livelihood that way any longer.  I asked him about this topic as well, and since he himself was not 100% sure, he asked both track's race secretaries who said that in most cases, suspensions are honored in all the major jurisdictions.  Illinois certainly would not let a rider suspended in Florida (or anywhere else) ride here, Asmussen can't train here until his days in Louisiana are completed, and other things like that. 

Again, they differentiated a suspension issued by the Stewards or regulatory body from an exclusion by a track or having a license denied (using the Torres example I cited yesterday).  They also said a suspension doesn't take effect until the rider either elects to serve the days or has exhaused all of his appeals (IRB, circuit court, etc.)

Sway, if you want answers, I'd suggest calling the IRB or even call the Stews at Hawthorne in the morning before races start, they'll answer your questions and you can share what they tell you with all of us and we can put this thread to bed once and for all.

Good luck on finding the answers you want - I can tell you sincerely want to know but sometimes it seems like unless you get the answer you want, your response is to fire back and tell us we are wrong.

Here's some numbers for you to call:

IRB 312-814-2600, a fellow named Mickey Ezzo is the information person there, or you can probably ask for Marc Laino, the ED.

HAW Stews office 708-780-3700 ext. 3680 (I don't feel bad posting this number as it is in the HAW cond. book for anyone to see)

Haw Race office 708-780-3690 (again its in the condition book)

TJG
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2006, 11:44:42 AM »

Mr. Graham I accept your final explanation as fact. You took the time to contact the proper people to secure the answer when no written verification is available. I was never looking for an answer I want I was looking for the factual answer and not hearsay. I am now satisfied that you did what you can to provide us with an accurate description of the enforcement of suspensions. Thank You!!
Report to moderator   Logged
Thomas Graham
Guest

« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2006, 11:59:41 AM »

Thanks Sway!  If I find anything else out, I'll keep you posted.
Report to moderator   Logged
nwaryas
Guest

« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2006, 01:30:10 PM »

Sway, you lose. I sure did like the way Dreaming of Anna won the Breeder's Cup Juvenile Fillies Race.
Report to moderator   Logged
APCD Dan
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 3850




Ignore
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2006, 01:59:20 PM »

E-mail from Tampa Bay Downs on the status of Jose Ferrer:

"Yes, Tampa Bay Downs will honor any suspension for any recognized track.

 

Margo Flynn
Vice President of Marketing and Publicity
Tampa Bay Downs, Inc
813-855-4401 ext. 1368
Fax 813-261-1832
mjflynn@tampabaydowns.com"

Sway, consider your ass nailed.  Any other uneducated opinions or challenges that you would like to make?
Report to moderator   Logged
Battled, Tired
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 519




Ignore
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2006, 04:11:09 PM »

I guess we'll know soon enough after the results come out today....I do see he is listed on one horse at Hawthorne Thursday and one A.E. at Tampa on Saturday.  I seem to recall these suspensions typically start on Fridays....
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2006, 06:43:04 PM »

E-mail from Tampa Bay Downs on the status of Jose Ferrer:

"Yes, Tampa Bay Downs will honor any suspension for any recognized track.

 

Margo Flynn
Vice President of Marketing and Publicity
Tampa Bay Downs, Inc
813-855-4401 ext. 1368
Fax 813-261-1832
mjflynn@tampabaydowns.com"

Sway, consider your ass nailed.  Any other uneducated opinions or challenges that you would like to make?


HEY ***hole you didn't nail anyone!! I was looking for an answer in the rules which is not there and Mr. Graham took the time to provide US ALL with the answer, for which I thanked him for. I may be uneducated but I fought for my country and your right to go to school which also earned me the right to call you ***hole!!
Report to moderator   Logged
SWAY BACK
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 947




Ignore
« Reply #49 on: December 12, 2006, 06:53:17 PM »

Sway, you lose. I sure did like the way Dreaming of Anna won the Breeder's Cup Juvenile Fillies Race.

Touche!
Report to moderator   Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.105 seconds with 16 queries.

Home
Upcoming events
Breeders' Cup
Horse slaughter in IL
Racing TV schedule
News Updates
Legislation

Galloping Out

Previous stories

Arlington
Balmoral
Hawthorne
Maywood
Chicago Sun-Times
Chicago Tribune
Blood-Horse
Daily Racing Form
Thoroughbred Times
Harness Link
Illinois Racing Board

 

2014

Breeders' Cup
Arlington Million
Triple Crown
Illinois Derby

2013

Breeders' Cup
Hawthorne Gold Cup
Arlington Million
Triple Crown
Illinois Derby

2012

Breeders' Cup
Hawthorne Gold Cup
Arlington Million
Triple Crown
Illinois Derby

More ebay items

 

Home | News Updates | Bloggers | Forums | Search
Resources | Links | Marketplace | Gallery | Advertising | Contact Us

Copyright © 2000-2014 Chicago Barn to Wire. All rights reserved.
Privacy policy