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Author Topic: One thing is clear about Morgan..  (Read 5734 times)
Careyscardshark
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« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2005, 11:11:14 AM »

Morgan rarely drives against the top drivers, if he did on a consistant basis we would all get a better idea on if he could.  I think he can, don't tell me I'm an idiot for saying that when you have nothing to back up your opinion other than a couple of times Morgan has had one drive while going to Canada or somewhere to drive against them.  He is 2nd in the country in wins, I have a logical opinion in saying he can drive with the big boys.  We can agree to disagree here, but you don't have anymore proof than I do that he can't other than your opinion.
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burton
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« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2005, 11:46:19 AM »

Sears only drove against Palone before he made the top 3 at the BigM?
Morgan could probably do something similiar.
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cumonwire
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« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2005, 01:13:52 PM »

You have to have the horses.  Ask Paisley about his trip to the BigM.  Just as great ballplayers make good managers great managers, great horses make good drivers great drivers.  That is why Sears is great and Campbell is good right now.
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baron
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« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2005, 02:25:14 PM »

Sorry bub, pretty much all you write is stupid and nonsensical. Humurous though, no doubt.

Which part?  There are three separate statements and all are TRUE!  Only the ghost ownership needs clarification.  Morgan was involved behind the scenes as owner in races where there was more than one horse in the race that he had some connection with.  Hence the control factor but more of a gambling factor.  His record at non-bush league tracks speaks for itself.  He gets his ass handed to him by the better drivers.  That's why Pompano and Dover were his first choices.  If money was the true driving force he would have selected the Meadowlands to prove he belongs.

You have confused purse structure with competition.  Dover's regular driver colony is BUSH League!  Slots have increased their purses from 1500 to 15000.  The reason they have so many Delaware owned or bred races is to keep competition OUT!  How many races has Morgan won when competing against Sears,  Miller,  Pierce and other top drivers?  Don't answer,  he only has to race against them on Mondays and he would head to Pompano if one of them relocated to Delaware.  My answer was only stupid to the clueless.
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baron
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« Reply #29 on: December 13, 2005, 02:27:25 PM »

You could say this about any driver, couldn't you?

Steve Warrington kicked ass up at Meadowlands against the big boys. But that was because he was on Sanabelle Island most of those drives.

Horsepower is certainly a big part of the equation. Morgan would be getting the horses that Brennan, Manzi, Ledford get and he would probably be in the lower half of the top 10 ..

Morgan rarely drives against the top drivers, if he did on a consistant basis we would all get a better idea on if he could.  I think he can, don't tell me I'm an idiot for saying that when you have nothing to back up your opinion other than a couple of times Morgan has had one drive while going to Canada or somewhere to drive against them.  He is 2nd in the country in wins, I have a logical opinion in saying he can drive with the big boys.  We can agree to disagree here, but you don't have anymore proof than I do that he can't other than your opinion.
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Chitown Stan
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« Reply #30 on: December 13, 2005, 03:07:52 PM »

Didn't Morgan go to the Meadowlands for 3 weeks about 3 or 4 years ago and come away 0 for about 50? Thats all the proof I need.
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Chitown Stan
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« Reply #31 on: December 13, 2005, 03:09:10 PM »

btw...I love how Morgan got schooled by Jim Morand yesterday as Morand drove E SHopper!! Keep betting him down to 3-5 all you Morgan lovers!
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Careyscardshark
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« Reply #32 on: December 13, 2005, 03:28:11 PM »

I'm done talking about this.  Not because I think you are right, but because this is going nowhere.  I think Morgan could hold his own and make a nice living driving at the Meadowlands against the big boys, you don't.  Until  we actually see him go there this is stupid to argue about.
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trotter1
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« Reply #33 on: December 13, 2005, 04:03:42 PM »

Exactly.
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baron
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« Reply #34 on: December 13, 2005, 04:47:48 PM »

You're right, all you can go on is when he races against teh big boys when they come to Dover and they embarrass him.

Excellent point.


I'm done talking about this.  Not because I think you are right, but because this is going nowhere.  I think Morgan could hold his own and make a nice living driving at the Meadowlands against the big boys, you don't.  Until  we actually see him go there this is stupid to argue about.
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cumonwire
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« Reply #35 on: December 13, 2005, 09:59:17 PM »

#1 Ron Pierce
#2 John Campbell
#3 Dave Magee
#4 Brian Sears
#5 Eric Ledford
#6 Dave Palone
#7 Tony Morgan
#8 Dave Miller
#9 Cat Manzi
#10 George Brennan

Tony Morgan 94 wins in 320 Dover Starts 29%  winners
Ron Pierce  20 wins in 87 Dover Starts  23% winners
Dave Miller 17 wins in 104 Dover Starts
Brian Sears 16 wins in 107 Dover Starts
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Zulu
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« Reply #36 on: December 13, 2005, 10:09:57 PM »

Where is Jim Morrill jr ?
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cumonwire
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« Reply #37 on: December 13, 2005, 10:25:03 PM »

Morrill is behind Yannick Gingras and Mike and Patrick Lachance and Dan Dube
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Chitown Stan
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« Reply #38 on: December 13, 2005, 11:03:42 PM »

Wait a minute, there is no argument. HE ALREADY WENT TO THE MEADOWLANDS AND COULDN'T HANG! Its not like he has never tried it before. HE HAS!
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njhorseman
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« Reply #39 on: December 13, 2005, 11:10:13 PM »

Where is Jim Morrill jr ?


He's in upstate NY, racing at Batavia and Buffalo.
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swoodall
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« Reply #40 on: December 14, 2005, 01:23:36 AM »

Ruckerfan

Your right,  Your PhD in ass kissing trumpets  33 years of observation any day.  I've watch Morgan from day 1 and he has driven my horses a couple of times.  He has even pulled my horse from the entry box and got Hansen's in claiming Aahm Your Man was entered too cheap any way.  Ask Ledford he was training and almost decked him over it.  Morgan selects the company he competes against by who and what he can control.  Just wait until he gets his 6 months residency requirement over at Dover and see how many horses from Chicago show up there under his name/control.  Then compare the ownership to who was listed here.  He will have to put him or Penelope down to meet the Delaware owned or bred requirement.  Unless someone else has relocated there too and we don't know about it.  Why don't you put your money where your nose is and give Morgan's behind a nice comfy place to sit,  like a 25-30 claimer with your name listed as owner.  No need to worry about your investment,  I'm sure he will take care of a big fan like you.  Unlike here,  you would have to tell them your real indentity.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2005, 03:14:05 AM by swoodall » Report to moderator   Logged
Zulu
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« Reply #41 on: December 14, 2005, 08:15:57 AM »

He's in upstate NY, racing at Batavia and Buffalo.

Thnaks NJ , I didn`t want to start a seperate thread for the question.
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baron
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« Reply #42 on: December 14, 2005, 10:24:52 AM »

What % of winners you think Pierce and Miller would have if they drove at Dover fulltime?

Somewhere around 97%..


#1 Ron Pierce
#2 John Campbell
#3 Dave Magee
#4 Brian Sears
#5 Eric Ledford
#6 Dave Palone
#7 Tony Morgan
#8 Dave Miller
#9 Cat Manzi
#10 George Brennan

Tony Morgan 94 wins in 320 Dover Starts 29%  winners
Ron Pierce  20 wins in 87 Dover Starts  23% winners
Dave Miller 17 wins in 104 Dover Starts
Brian Sears 16 wins in 107 Dover Starts
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baron
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« Reply #43 on: December 14, 2005, 10:26:40 AM »

Morgan is not bringing in horses from Chicago, that was clearly stated to him in the beginning. (As well as knowing that if they see Chicago horses coming in under someone else's name with him driving). Trust me on this.


Ruckerfan

Your right,  Your PhD in ass kissing trumpets  33 years of observation any day.  I've watch Morgan from day 1 and he has driven my horses a couple of times.  He has even pulled my horse from the entry box and got Hansen's in claiming Aahm Your Man was entered too cheap any way.  Ask Ledford he was training and almost decked him over it.  Morgan selects the company he competes against by who and what he can control.  Just wait until he gets his 6 months residency requirement over at Dover and see how many horses from Chicago show up there under his name/control.  Then compare the ownership to who was listed here.  He will have to put him or Penelope down to meet the Delaware owned or bred requirement.  Unless someone else has relocated there too and we don't know about it.  Why don't you put your money where your nose is and give Morgan's behind a nice comfy place to sit,  like a 25-30 claimer with your name listed as owner.  No need to worry about your investment,  I'm sure he will take care of a big fan like you.  Unlike here,  you would have to tell them your real indentity.
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Heede
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« Reply #44 on: December 14, 2005, 10:47:26 AM »

Morgan is head over heels better than the regular driving colony at Dover.
Like taking candy from a bunch of closed racing babies. I think it is great.
But Illinois is closed when it comes to our stake program.  This is also BULLSH*t.
I know Terry will not like.  I also believe the Cole Mufflers can race with any caliber of horse
out there.  Open it up and bring in a better product.  Shocked Shocked
Something has to change.

Mike VanDeHeede
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baron
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« Reply #45 on: December 14, 2005, 10:58:38 AM »

Why does it have to change? They're privately owned, they can do whatever the hell they want.

Morgan is head over heels better than the regular driving colony at Dover.
Like taking candy from a bunch of closed racing babies. I think it is great.
But Illinois is closed when it comes to our stake program.  This is also BULLSH*t.
I know Terry will not like.  I also believe the Cole Mufflers can race with any caliber of horse
out there.  Open it up and bring in a better product.  Shocked Shocked
Something has to change.

Mike VanDeHeede
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burton
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« Reply #46 on: December 14, 2005, 11:09:09 AM »

Morgan drove against most of the big guns yestaerday and only won 6 races.
Not bad.
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swoodall
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« Reply #47 on: December 14, 2005, 12:30:48 PM »

Baron

I was unaware of them warning him about bringing in Illinois horses.  If your right and it sounds like you know,  then why would he move to Dover if not for the easy pickings!?  In his interview he pointed out the purse structure being supported by slots as his main reason to move there.  If he can't bring in his own horses then that leaves claiming Delaware bred or owned as his only option after his residency requirement is met.
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baron
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« Reply #48 on: December 14, 2005, 12:31:58 PM »

Look at the big picture.. (You won't because it would make you look foolish, so forget it)


Morgan drove against most of the big guns yestaerday and only won 6 races.
Not bad.
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baron
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« Reply #49 on: December 14, 2005, 12:33:08 PM »

I am not sure what your actual question is here. I thought it was quite clear he moved because of the big purses at Dover and the horrible state of Chicago racing. Was that unclear?


Baron

I was unaware of them warning him about bringing in Illinois horses.  If your right and it sounds like you know,  then why would he move to Dover if not for the easy pickings!?  In his interview he pointed out the purse structure being supported by slots as his main reason to move there.  If he can't bring in his own horses then that leaves claiming Delaware bred or owned as his only option after his residency requirement is met.
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